Those Shoes - Stevie?

[sodascouts]

I'm spending the weekend with a couple fellow Stevie fans after her concert in Chicago and one of them said to me that she had read an interview where Don said "Those Shoes" was inspired by one time when he went by a shoe store with Stevie Nicks. She wanted to buy yet another pair of shoes - these were red. He told her she didn't need them, but she went back later and bought them anyway. Then, he saw them and wasn't too thrilled with her for it!

Does anyone know of this article or has anyone ever heard this story? I realize he wrote it with Glenn Frey and Don Felder, and that in other interviews it hasn't been mentioned, but you know how it is - sometimes they tell different stories at different times, and sometimes an event will spark a song even if it technically isn't "about" that event. However, this could just be Stevie-land urban legend, too! I thought I'd ask.

[Freypower]

I've never heard this. It could be true but to me Those Shoes is a generic song about a very specific type of woman. Shoes are a metaphor. I wonder sometimes... why is it that some Stevie Nicks fans think that all Don Henley songs are about Stevie Nicks?

[Molly]

Seems like I remember reading a quote from either Don or Glenn that said something like they were big fans of the high heeled shoes with the ankle straps that were in fashion back then (and are in fashion again now, I guess). Some sort of latent shoe festish, or a metaphor as Julie said? I suppose we'll never really know. :wink:

[sodascouts]

I wonder sometimes... why is it that some Stevie Nicks fans think that all Don Henley songs are about Stevie Nicks?

I can assure you that I have never heard of anyone in the Stevie fandom that thinks that all of Don Henley's songs are about Stevie. Of course I realize you were using hyperbole and didn't mean it literally, but for the record, as far as I know, there are only about seven songs that Stevie fans speculate may be partially inspired by her, and I am including in that number the erroneous assumption about "Witchy Woman." The others that I have heard speculation about are the following: "Life in the Fast Lane," "Victim of Love," "Miss Ghost," "Not Enough Love in the World," and "Heart of the Matter." I and most Stevie fans (including my friend) do not even believe that all of those are about Stevie, but they are the commonly discussed songs. (Perhaps that's more than you wanted to know! lol)

As for my friend, she doesn't even know the song "Those Shoes" or its lyrics. She just thought she'd read that somewhere and asked me if I'd heard the story, since I'm someone who also likes the Eagles.

Right now it looks like it's just a myth, though, unless anyone has heard differently! Thanks for the responses, FP and Molly. (Shoe fetish - lol!)

[Freypower]

I thought by now it was common knowledge that HOTM is about Maren Jensen.

The next question is has Joe, whose relationship with Stevie was deeper and longer lasting, ever written any songs about her? I know she wrote at least two for him.

[DonFan]

Nancy, I have read everything I can get my hands on about Don, and I have never heard a mention about Those Shoes and Stevie.
Makes an entertaining story, though!

[sodascouts]

Thanks again, guys. Looks like it's a no! Oh, well, too bad!

As for Joe, I'm not sure if he's written anything about Stevie, but he has said regarding The Confessor that she was "pretty much responsible for that whole album" because she encouraged him to continue making albums - told him that he "wasn't finished." And look at him now! ;)

[sodascouts]

I thought by now it was common knowledge that HOTM is about Maren Jensen.


I forgot to address this part - I don't think it's common knowledge at all. Outside of the Henley fandom, I daresay there are not many people who even know who she is, much less that she and Henley dated.

Even within the fandom, I think you'd find that many fans have no idea who Heart of the Matter is about or who Maren Jensen is. I know amongst us hardcores it's easy to forget that if you talk to the Henley fan sitting next to you at a concert and ask that person to name even one of Henley's girlfriends aside from Stevie Nicks, he/she wouldn't be able to.

[Maleah]

I've heard that about HOTM but I don't have a clue who Maren Jensen is though. It'd be interesting to see what she looks like though....or at least what she used to look like. ;) :lol:

[sodascouts]

This was from around the time they got together (maybe a couple years earlier):

http://www.icelebz.com/celebs/maren_jensen/images/photo6.jpg

She is most famous for her role on Battlestar Galactica, the series (1978-1979). I'm afraid that according to IMDB (http://www.icelebz.com/celebs/maren_jensen/images/photo6.jpg), she hasn't done anything of note in the movie/television industry since 1981. She did, however, appear in Don's Not Enough Love in the World video as the female actress. You can't see her very well here, but here is a capture:

http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b141/glennfreyonline/don/nelitw.jpg

[DonFan]

Maren was VERY beautiful and they made quite a striking pair.

I think the main reason she didn't act very much in later years is because she was diagnosed with Epstein-Barr (chronic fatigue) syndrome. Don was quoted in the book "To The Limit" saying that he took her to several doctors before it was finally diagnosed, and the whole situation became very difficult to deal with: "I was dating this beautiful girl who shortly thereafter became practically an invalid. She was literally in bed for a year."

He goes on to say in the book that "Maren & I stayed together until 1986. It was hard for her because her career had been cut short by illness and by the time of my second solo album I was starting to make it big again.....Finally she moved out, partly because of some reprehensible behavior on my part.... I felt a great sense of sadness."

[moonrambler]

Thanks again, guys. Looks like it's a no! Oh, well, too bad!

As for Joe, I'm not sure if he's written anything about Stevie, but he has said regarding The Confessor that she was "pretty much responsible for that whole album" because she encouraged him to continue making albums - told him that he "wasn't finished." And look at him now! ;)
Hi everybody!

It's interesting this came up because I've been wanting to ask you something about Stevie's songs. Similar to how some fans figure Don's songs are about Stevie when they're not, ever since I read about Stevie's relationship with Joe, now it always seems to me that all her songs are about him. :roll: There is one specific instance though that I wondered if you knew about, or have an opinion about -- the placement of "No Spoken Word" directly before "Has Anyone Ever Written Anything For You." It makes me wonder if she answers her question "What was it she wanted?" by placing "Has Anyone" right afterward.

Joe doesn't really do much in the way of love songs, or lost-love songs. There was speculation on a couple boards that "Dear John" from The Confessor album was about Stevie, but I really think that was about his ex-wife.

[Ive always been a dreamer]

Hello MR and let me be the first to welcome you. Hope you like it here on The Border. We're glad you found us. Unfortunately, I have no opinion about who Stevie may have been addressing, but I'll bet Soda has something to say about it. :wink:

Edited to add: I forgot to mention that Maren was very beautiful and she and Don made a lovely couple. Unfortunately or fortunately, as we sometimes say, the relationship didn't work out. But I think things always happen for a reason. I believe I've read that she and Don remained close after their split.

[DonFan]

Hey moonrambler! Welcome!

I always found it interesting that Stevie had relationships with both Don and Joe, since the two men are so different. Joe is always kidding around about how Don always gives him a hard time, like on Farewell I when he says "Henley's not done with me yet."
Very interesting dynamic between those two, in more ways than one.

[glenneaglesfan]

Hi moonrambler, welcome from me, too! It's good to see you here. I'm afraid I don't know about that Stevie quote either, but I'm sure Soda will have some information.

DF, I count myself as one who didn't know much about Maren Jensen. I knew she had been Don's girlfriend, and that he regretted having treated her badly when she was ill, up drinking all night with his friends, then wasted for the next day. I didn't know she was an actress and had been in Battlestar Galactica. She's very beautiful in that picture.

[Brooke]

Welcome from me, too, moonrambler! Glad to have ya! :D

I was shocked to learn that Stevie had had a relationship with Joe. I'd always known about her and Don, but not about Joe. And I'm glad it never caused any friction between Joe and Don. Or did it?

[timfan]

Hi Moonrambler! :) Welcome to the Border! Hope you enjoy it here.

In terms of Stevie having relationships with both Don and Joe; it is very interesting but just shows a woman can be attracted to more than one 'type' of man. :wink: :D

[DonFan]

In terms of Stevie having relationships with both Don and Joe; it is very interesting but just shows a woman can be attracted to more than one 'type' of man. :wink: :D

How true!

[SweetHolly]

Welcome moonrambler!
I've read that same article that said that Don and Maren are still close friends.

[Freypower]

Moonrambler, I am glad you found us. Welcome. 8)

Dear John was the track from The Confessor that came to my mind as well but I don't know enough about the situation.

[moonrambler]

Moonrambler, I am glad you found us. Welcome. 8)

Dear John was the track from The Confessor that came to my mind as well but I don't know enough about the situation.
Several reasons I think Dear John is about Joe's ex-wife and not about Stevie.

A) there's that nasty little interview he gave that gets quoted now and then, where he talks about how music comes first, and that basically he wound up getting divorced because music comes first. This is the general theme of Dear John -- beginning with "I started out to write you this letter, but it ended up another song." And "I've just got to get back to my music" -- I don't see Stevie trying to keep him from his music.

B) "we both promised forever"

C) I figure the song's placement on the album is important, as the final song -- the end. It seems more likely to me it was about a years-long marriage ending rather than a shorter relationship.

D) and the main thing, his ex-wife's name is Juanita. As far as I can tell, she usually went by a nickname, but that's her given name.

[sodascouts]

It's interesting this came up because I've been wanting to ask you something about Stevie's songs. Similar to how some fans figure Don's songs are about Stevie when they're not, ever since I read about Stevie's relationship with Joe, now it always seems to me that all her songs are about him. :roll: There is one specific instance though that I wondered if you knew about, or have an opinion about -- the placement of "No Spoken Word" directly before "Has Anyone Ever Written Anything For You." It makes me wonder if she answers her question "What was it she wanted?" by placing "Has Anyone" right afterward.

Welcome from me, too!

For those not familiar with the song "No Spoken Word" off of Stevie's Rock a Little album, here they are:

I was just that old
That August dark, dark day
Swear that you never saw her face
Swear that you never heard her say

No spoken word
No small command
What was it she wanted?
They say she had everything

No spoken word
No small command
What was it she wanted?
They say she had everything

What shall I do?
What shall I say?
Should I say, well, all the things
That I'd like to say to you

No spoken word
No small command
What was it she wanted?
They say she had everything

Let's make a deal, here

For one night
Well, baby, you fill the night with
The wind and the rain and the water
For one night
Well, just for one night
You know that
Well, that disastrous sound

Now it will make me wiser
He says, "And it will make you look"
She says, "Look out!
I don't know how to learn
From the pages of a book
Well, I either say too much
Or I, I don't say enough
Well, I play too hard
Still I'm not tough enough"
What was it she wanted?
They say she had everything

No spoken word
No small command, hey, hey
What was it she wanted?
They say she had everything

Come around tonight indecent
Well...baby
Come around tonight
Indecent, baby, well
You fill the room
With the rain and the wind and the water

If you tell me one more time
"Baby, take it easy"
Well, you won't see me ever again
Some people walk down the darkened streets
With the faith of a child
And so go the faithless
But after a while she says...

No spoken word
Let's make a deal, here
No small command
What was it she wanted
They said she had...
Oh, I don't want to know about it...

--------------------

My friend who is staying with me this week and I have been debating this. What's confusing is that Stevie has a habit of switching from first to third person when talking about herself. You can interpret this as a woman angry about her man cheating on her, or you can interpret this as Stevie's relationship with her man (Joe?) getting very complicated. My friend and I are thinking it does indeed fit Joe. Let's do a "close reading," to use a literary term. Note: This is all speculation.

I was just that old
That August dark, dark day
Swear that you never saw her face
Swear that you never heard her say

No spoken word
No small command
What was it she wanted?
They say she had everything


Stevie has complained in interviews that Joe didn't listen to her, that he wanted to play around with his buddies instead of be with her. She has said that she would have given up her career for Joe if he "would just have been serious for one minute." Now, she could have been exaggerating, but if she feels he was immature in the relationship, that could make her feel "old." The "What was it she wanted" could also play into that - did she really want to give up her career? Or was that just talk? As a rock star, they said she had everything, but did she have love?

What shall I do?
What shall I say?
Should I say, well, all the things
That I'd like to say to you

Should she let Joe know how serious she is, how hurt she is by his seeming lack of commitment?

Let's make a deal, here

For one night
Well, baby, you fill the night with
The wind and the rain and the water
For one night
Well, just for one night
You know that
Well, that disastrous sound

Not to be indelicate, but perhaps the sex - or the violently intense level of emotional connection she feels when with him - is making it worth it, even if it's just for one night before he has to go on tour or whatever - basically, has to leave. I think that is the "disastrous sound" - "goodbye."


Now it will make me wiser
He says, "And it will make you look"
She says, "Look out!
I don't know how to learn
From the pages of a book
Well, I either say too much
Or I, I don't say enough
Well, I play too hard
Still I'm not tough enough"
What was it she wanted?
They say she had everything

She and he, having a fight perhaps - she talks about the way he treats her will make her wiser, and he agrees! So she changes tactics - she doesn't learn from her mistakes in that way. She never seems to say the right things to get him to do what she wants him to do, and in that sense doesn't know "how to learn." She "plays hard" with Joe because that's what he wants, but still she's "not tough enough" to endure the emotional disconnect when he leaves. Again, does she really want more attachment? Perhaps he is the one that suspects she doesn't really want what she is asking for.

Come around tonight indecent
Well...baby
Come around tonight
Indecent, baby, well
You fill the room
With the rain and the wind and the water

If you tell me one more time
"Baby, take it easy"
Well, you won't see me ever again
Some people walk down the darkened streets
With the faith of a child
And so go the faithless

The "come around tonight indecent" seems to be another reference to the emphasis on their sex life being good, perhaps being the only time she feels they truly connect. When she wants or even demands more, Joe tells her "take it easy" - and she makes that threat that he won't ever see her again as a result. But does she want to take it back? Does she want him to forget about it, as if she's said "No spoken word" or "no small command"?

Complicated, huh? That was fun. I've never thought about it being about Joe, but now it makes a lot more sense to me.

By the way, I don't know if I've told you this before, but "Long Way to Go" on The Other Side of the Mirror is about their final breakup (they broke up at least twice).

You can find more information about Stevie and Joe in this thread:
https://www.eaglesonlinecentral.com/forum/showthread.php?t=209

[glenneaglesfan]

Wow, Soda, that's some analysis. It's interesting that Stevie uses this metaphor

For one night
Well, baby, you fill the night with
The wind and the rain and the water
It reminds me of that line in 'Sara', which I think goes like this:

And he was just like a great dark wind within the wings of a storm
I hadn't realised she and Joe had broken up twice.
Thanks for the link back to the other thread.

[moonrambler]

Complicated, huh? That was fun. I've never thought about it being about Joe, but now it makes a lot more sense to me.

By the way, I don't know if I've told you this before, but "Long Way to Go" on The Other Side of the Mirror is about their final breakup (they broke up at least twice).
I'm glad the work you did on that was fun, because that was quite an in-depth interpretation! The way you looked at that song is enlightening because I have to tell you, I had no idea what in the world most of it is about. But those lines "What was it she wanted? They say she had everything" are totally clear. She sounds angry, bitter, sarcastic. And I can almost imagine what she felt like -- everybody figured she had it so totally made -- beautiful, successful, etc. But in reality she was heartbroken because she couldn't have the one person she really wanted at that point in time.

I had read somewhere that Long Way To Go is about them also, and I also read an interview with her where she tells about that night, and how she cried all the way home . . . man, he must've really been something when he was being nice, for her to love him so much, because he sounds like he was such a louse back then :x

edit: typo

[sodascouts]

Wow, Soda, that's some analysis. It's interesting that Stevie uses this metaphor

For one night
Well, baby, you fill the night with
The wind and the rain and the water
It reminds me of that line in 'Sara', which I think goes like this:

And he was just like a great dark wing within the wings of a storm

I know what you mean. Both are variations of storms being associated with not only intense feeling, but passionate sexual intimacy.

[sodascouts]

I'm glad the work you did on that was fun, because that was quite an in-depth interpretation! The way you looked at that song is enlightening because I have to tell you, I had no idea what in the world most of it is about.

You're not the only one, lol.


But those lines "What was it she wanted? They say she had everything" are totally clear. She sounds angry, bitter, sarcastic. And I can almost imagine what she felt like -- everybody figured she had it so totally made -- beautiful, sucessful, etc. But in reality she was heartbroken because she couldn't have the one person she really wanted at that point in time.

Exactly - and to this day she expresses sadness at not being able to find true love or have a family due to the choices she made when she was at the height of her success.


I had read somewhere that Long Way To Go is about them also, and I also read an interview with her where she tells about that night, and how she cried all the way home . . . man, he must've really been something when he was being nice, for her to love him so much, because he sounds like he was such a louse back then :x

Again, I'm just speculating, but the way Stevie talks about how she could see his pain even when he hid it from others... I think she felt like he needed her, and she could understand him even when no one else could. Perhaps that drew her to him even when he was being an ass - she knew that it wasn't the REAL Joe.

Many Stevie fans dislike Joe intensely because he called Stevie nothing more than a "road f*ck" in an interview with Howard Stern in 1995. I'm sure he was just going for a laugh and didn't really mean it, but it won him no friends in that camp! lol He apparently also made a silly joke about her at a concert in '94 and mocked her at his Jones Beach show in 1990. I should note that as far as I know, he has said nice things when asked about her in more recent times.

[moonrambler]

Many Stevie fans dislike Joe intensely because he called Stevie nothing more than a "road f*ck" in an interview with Howard Stern in 1995. I'm sure he was just going for a laugh and didn't really mean it, but it won him no friends in that camp! lol He apparently also made a silly joke about her at a concert in '94 and mocked her at his Jones Beach show in 1990. I should note that as far as I know, he has said nice things when asked about her in more recent times.
I think that stupid comment had to have been before he quit using, and y'know what -- the 1995 date can't be right -- he didn't do any interviews with Howard once he got sober, until just a couple years ago. 1985 maybe? Even so, I don't understand why he'd want to be so awful about her, unless he was p.o.'d/hurt that she walked out and wouldn't put up with his b.s. anymore.


Again, I'm just speculating, but the way Stevie talks about how she could see his pain even when he hid it from others... I think she felt like he needed her, and she could understand him even when no one else could. Perhaps that drew her to him even when he was being an ass - she knew that it wasn't the REAL Joe.
I think he probably did need her, and I think he's acknowledged this to a degree also. Saying that she was responsible for The Confessor album ever coming into existence, for instance -- that's quite a statement. And I think the fact that she's the only person he thanked by name in the liner notes on that album also was quite a statement.

And in a fairly recent radio interview with call-ins, he even said she helped him get through losing his daughter -- which I thought was noticeable since their relationship took place ten years after he lost Emma. In all that time, it sounds like Stevie was the one who managed to get through to him on some level.

I've found it surprising that Stevie has been so encouraging of him all along, while he was acting like such a jerk. What she wrote in the liner notes for "Has Anyone" on Timespace, although it tells the tale for the audience of how the song came to be written, her words seem obviously directed at Joe.

So, a couple more questions that I have wondered about. I think she acknowledged in a concert program at some point that he was the one she wrote the song for, and that was the first time she explained that. Do you have any theory as to why she decided at that moment to explain publicly who the song was for? Also, the liner notes on Timespace -- they are so encouraging to him, that it made me wonder if she wrote them because she saw how badly he was sinking into the booze & coke & self-destruction. Maybe?

[sodascouts]

I think that stupid comment had to have been before he quit using, and y'know what -- the 1995 date can't be right -- he didn't do any interviews with Howard once he got sober, until just a couple years ago. 1985 maybe? Even so, I don't understand why he'd want to be so awful about her, unless he was p.o.'d/hurt that she walked out and wouldn't put up with his b.s. anymore.

I investigated it a bit because I don't want to spread misinformation. Here is one fan's memory of the show (scroll down to reply #21 by "Soft Silver Chain.") Warning: some people are being immature in the thread below. Also, I'm not saying these fans are representative of Stevie fans in general. There are many boards in the Fleetwood Mac fandom, and this board (Seven Wonders) has a bit of a reputation as attracting mostly a younger crowd (no offense to the teens and preteens!)
http://www.sevenwondersonline.net/index.php/topic,1903.15.html

However, I can find no such interview recorded, and the last known appearance of Joe on Howard Stern is 1993 up until 2005, I believe. So you're right in that Kelly (SoftSilverChain) must have her dates wrong. I had always assumed the comment was pre-sobriety, too. In fact, in my original post above, I put it was an interview in the eighties, then went to look it up to be sure and was very shocked to find the 1995 date!


I think he probably did need her, and I think he's acknowledged this to a degree also. Saying that she was responsible for The Confessor album ever coming into existence, for instance -- that's quite a statement. And I think the fact that she's the only person he thanked by name in the liner notes on that album also was quite a statement.

And in a fairly recent radio interview with call-ins, he even said she helped him get through losing his daughter -- which I thought was noticeable since their relationship took place ten years after he lost Emma. In all that time, it sounds like Stevie was the one who managed to get through to him on some level.

That really is a testament to their relationship.


I've found it surprising that Stevie has been so encouraging of him all along, while he was acting like such a jerk. What she wrote in the liner notes for "Has Anyone" on Timespace, although it tells the tale for the audience of how the song came to be written, her words seem obviously directed at Joe.

She probably chalked it up to defense mechanisms. SHe has said that the fact that she understood him so well "scared" him.


So, a couple more questions that I have wondered about. I think she acknowledged in a concert program at some point that he was the one she wrote the song for, and that was the first time she explained that. Do you have any theory as to why she decided at that moment to explain publicly who the song was for? Also, the liner notes on Timespace -- they are so encouraging to him, that it made me wonder if she wrote them because she saw how badly he was sinking into the booze & coke & self-destruction. Maybe?

I didn't realize that the first time it had been mentioned was in a tour program. I will have to ask one of my friends who collects Stevie's tours programs to look it up and see what it says. I only collect Fleetwood Mac tour programs - and Eagles and Glenn Frey, of course. ;)

As for TimeSpace, I think it was just a coincidence in the sense that she wrote extensive liner notes for all of her songs on TimeSpace. However, she does address him personally: "Thank you, Joe, for the most committed song I ever wrote... But more than that, thank you for inspiring me in so many ways. Nothing in my life ever seems as dark anymore since we took that drive." That's pretty impressive.

When she performed it live, she used to introduce the song as being about everyone, about anyone who was suffering in her audience. I'm not sure she was comfortable talking about it onstage, because one time in 1989 she started to talk about it and actually stopped herself.

As you said, originally, she never said a name - only gave hints. For examples, check out the first two quotes on Ali's page:

http://www.inherownwords.com/hasanyone.htm

It's interesting to read them now, knowing it was Joe she was talking about.

[Ive always been a dreamer]

Told ya that Soda would have something to say about this! :wink:

It is very interesting to hear about this stuff. I think most of the guys have admitted to sometimes being jerks regarding the way they treated some of their ladies when they were younger. Thankfully, they have matured and I don't think you would hear any of them say stuff like that now.

[moonrambler]

I think that stupid comment had to have been before he quit using, and y'know what -- the 1995 date can't be right -- he didn't do any interviews with Howard once he got sober, until just a couple years ago. 1985 maybe? Even so, I don't understand why he'd want to be so awful about her, unless he was p.o.'d/hurt that she walked out and wouldn't put up with his b.s. anymore.

I investigated it a bit because I don't want to spread misinformation. Here is one fan's memory of the show (scroll down to reply #21 by "Soft Silver Chain.") Warning: some people are being immature in the thread below. Also, I'm not saying these fans are representative of Stevie fans in general. There are many boards in the Fleetwood Mac fandom, and this board (Seven Wonders) has a bit of a reputation as attracting mostly a younger crowd (no offense to the teens and preteens!)
http://www.sevenwondersonline.net/index.php/topic,1903.15.html

However, I can find no such interview recorded, and the last known appearance of Joe on Howard Stern is 1993 up until 2005, I believe. So you're right in that Kelly (SoftSilverChain) must have her dates wrong. I had always assumed the comment was pre-sobriety, too. In fact, in my original post above, I put it was an interview in the eighties, then went to look it up to be sure and was very shocked to find the 1995 date!
Ok, I read through that link. Even though she keeps saying she heard it, and she heard it in '95, that date has to be wrong. There was a big to-do the last time Joe was on Howard's show in the '90s, which I assume must have been taped and then edited each day for national airing later, and Joe had sung "Desperado" on that show and he was all wasted and it was pretty awful. Joe called Howard later and asked him not to run that, but of course Howard did, and Joe never went back on there again for years and years.

That makes me also wonder about this remark, "He opened for some band that I went to see in 94 in NH," -- where he supposedly made fun of Stevie. He would have been very busy with the Eagles in '94, as early as February, and not opening for some nameless band in NH.

It was that same website where I found the quote from the program, but I was wrong about the timing -- because it was the Timespace tour book. So apparently she first explained on the Timespace album that the song was written for Joe, and then said it again on the program. I think I must have read something on a message board somewhere that somebody first saw that information on that program. The quote from the program as they have it on Seven Wonders:

"He had written a song for his baby that he had lost, and I wrote a song for the both of them. My life changed that day. I told the public it was theirs and mine, but it never was, it was my Joe's song, and I would never, ever be the same..."
~Stevie Nicks, Timespace tourbook, 1991


As for TimeSpace, I think it was just a coincidence in the sense that she wrote extensive liner notes for all of her songs on TimeSpace. However, she does address him personally: "Thank you, Joe, for the most committed song I ever wrote... But more than that, thank you for inspiring me in so many ways. Nothing in my life ever seems as dark anymore since we took that drive." That's pretty impressive.
Also the words she quotes from her song right after that, made me wonder if she was telling him something, again, just like in the mid-80s, where she had been telling him he wasn't "finished." Beginning with "Thank you, Joe," and going on to quote from her song with "If not for me, do it for the world," and wrapping up with the word "LEGEND" in capital letters . . . that was a very personal statement to him, I thought.

[sodascouts]

Ok, I read through that link. Even though she keeps saying she heard it, and she heard it in '95, that date has to be wrong. There was a big to-do the last time Joe was on Howard's show in the '90s, which I assume must have been taped and then edited each day for national airing later, and Joe had sung "Desperado" on that show and he was all wasted and it was pretty awful. Joe called Howard later and asked him not to run that, but of course Howard did, and Joe never went back on there again for years and years.

Is that what happened? Very understandable that Joe was peeved. I also read that supposedly one of Howard Stern's supposed "funniest moments" was having some guest of his call up Joe Walsh when he was drunk and letting the two men make fools of themselves. Some friend, huh?


That makes me also wonder about this remark, "He opened for some band that I went to see in 94 in NH," -- where he supposedly made fun of Stevie. He would have been very busy with the Eagles in '94, as early as February, and not opening for some nameless band in NH.

Good point.


It was that same website where I found the quote from the program, but I was wrong about the timing -- because it was the Timespace tour book. So apparently she first explained on the Timespace album that the song was written for Joe, and then said it again on the program. I think I must have read something on a message board somewhere that somebody first saw that information on that program. The quote from the program as they have it on Seven Wonders:

"He had written a song for his baby that he had lost, and I wrote a song for the both of them. My life changed that day. I told the public it was theirs and mine, but it never was, it was my Joe's song, and I would never, ever be the same..."
~Stevie Nicks, Timespace tourbook, 1991

Also the words she quotes from her song right after that, made me wonder if she was telling him something, again, just like in the mid-80s, where she had been telling him he wasn't "finished." Beginning with "Thank you, Joe," and going on to quote from her song with "If not for me, do it for the world," and wrapping up with the word "LEGEND" in capital letters . . . that was a very personal statement to him, I thought.

I see what you mean. There is no doubt the song was written for him and those last lines describe him. Even if you look at the plural "poets, priests of nothing, legends" as including the various musicians she'd been with at the time - Lindsey Buckingham, Don Henley, Mick Fleetwood, etc - Joe was the primary one, the "you" of the title, and that carries throughout.

[moonrambler]

I also read that supposedly one of Howard Stern's supposed "funniest moments" was having some guest of his call up Joe Walsh when he was drunk and letting the two men make fools of themselves. Some friend, huh?
And now it seems like all is forgiven and forgotten, and I don't get what people see in Howard Stern, but that's a whole 'nother story! I suppose Joe eventually decided it was his own fault for going around in that condition in the first place.


That makes me also wonder about this remark, "He opened for some band that I went to see in 94 in NH," -- where he supposedly made fun of Stevie. He would have been very busy with the Eagles in '94, as early as February, and not opening for some nameless band in NH.

Good point.
Now I'm not claiming he never did any lousy stuff like they are saying -- I just don't see it happening that far down the pike, especially once he got sober, particularly since he's very involved in AA and one of their 12 Steps is to make amends.


Even if you look at the plural "poets, priests of nothing, legends" as including the various musicians she'd been with at the time - Lindsey Buckingham, Don Henley, Mick Fleetwood, etc - Joe was the primary one, the "you" of the title, and that carries throughout.
And now look at these guys today -- I don't know much about Lindsey and Mick's lives outside of music, but Joe becoming more talkative about his substance abuse problems and recovery, writing music about it, and working with groups focusing on recovery; and Don with his Walden Woods project, historical preservation in TX, and Recording Artists Coalition -- the priests of nothing certainly have changed with time!

[Ive always been a dreamer]

I remember watching that Stern interview when Joe sang Desperado. He was quite wasted, but I don't remember anything about him calling Stevie a "road f*ck". I could be wrong, but it seems to me that I would have remembered that if he had said it. I'm definately not claiming that he was incapable of saying something like that, but I don't think it was that interview. What I do remember is that I think this is when Don and Glenn got really pi$$ed at Joe for singing Desperado. It was pretty awful considering the state he was in. :wink:

[sodascouts]

What I do remember is that I think this is when Don and Glenn got really pi$$ed at Joe for singing Desperado. It was pretty awful considering the state he was in.

Dreamer, I think they might have been OK with it if it had just been a one-time drunken mistake, but he sang it regularly on his '91 tour. Apparently they disapproved.

[Ive always been a dreamer]

Oh - I didn't know that Joe ever had Desperado in his tour set list. I thought he only did it that one time. As many covers, etc. that have been done of Desperado, I always thought that it was odd that Don and Glenn got upset about Joe singing it. I guess - to paraphrase an old line - that they 'had their reasons'. This is just speculation, but maybe Don and Glenn thought that it was inappropriate because Joe is an Eagle, but didn't write the song, and he wasn't in the group when the song was written and recorded. :?: :?: :?:

[sodascouts]

Oh - I didn't know that Joe ever had Desperado in his tour set list. I thought he only did it that one time. As many covers, etc. that have been done of Desperado, I always thought that it was odd that Don and Glenn got upset about Joe singing it. I guess - to paraphrase an old line - that they 'had their reasons'. This is just speculation, but maybe Don and Glenn thought that it was inappropriate because Joe is an Eagle, but didn't write the song, and he wasn't in the group when the song was written and recorded. :?: :?: :?:

I guess so, dreamer. I've always been a bit puzzled by their hostility towards the idea as well. After all, Glenn sung Rocky Mountain Way in his '92 set! (Admittedly, he did say he had Joe's permission, but still!) Why should they begrudge him Desperado?

Although I also have to say I'm not sure why he chose to do it in the first place. It doesn't really seem suited to his voice. I think Take It Easy or something like that might have been a better choice - but I guess he had his reasons.

[sodascouts]

Coincidentally, I just got a bootleg video from Joe's '91 tour and watched it tonight. I guess there was some tension because at one point, Joe jokes, "You know, Glenn Frey was a lot more fun before he started taking steroids." Then he adds "Just kidding!" lol

[SweetHolly]

LOL!!!!

[DonFan]

Since we were talking about Maren Jensen earlier in this thread, I remembered that I read a more recent quote from Don about Maren. It was from an interview done with Timothy White in Billboard magazine in 2000, promoting Inside Job:

Timothy: "But knowing many women you’ve dated for a long time, I’m aware that you’re very loyal to them and they speak well of you."

Don: "I know what you mean. I am good friends with most of my exes. And sometimes it took several years to get back to that point with those people, but if you love somebody they become part of your life. Especially in Maren’s case. We went through a lot together, and we’re still very close friends, and she’s about to have a baby any day now, and my wife and I are gonna have one any day now, too [Julia Sophia Henley, Don and the former Sharon Summerall’s third child, was born two days after this interview.] She and her husband are doing very well, and I helped her get her business off the ground, and now they’ve just sold it to Estee Lauder, and she’s fixed for the rest of her life. But my life has changed, too. I finally woke up one day and took a look around and said to myself, “I don’t want to be the last guy at the party. It’s too sad.” The guy with the lampshade on after the party is not me, and I snapped out of it. And the universe responded in kind and sent me Sharon. [The couple married in 1995.] And then the kids came [including a daughter, Annabel, and a son, Will] and that really changed everything. So these songs are heartfelt, although some may scoff. But that’s OK."

[JoeFan]

Hi, I'm new to register. I've been reading a long time though. I know this is the Don forum and I don't want to hijack the thread again... but I've read about Don and Glenn getting steamed when Joe performed Desperado and I just think that's ridiculous. He wasn't hurting anyone and I think it's safe to say he wasn't doing it as an insult. It's a compliment to them that he wanted to cover their song, they should be honoured, not offended. He also said he was just kidding when he made that joke about Glenn so why would it be a sign of tension?

[SweetHolly]

Welcome JoeFan! Glad you decided to join! :D

[JoeFan]

Thanks Sweet Holly. :)

[SweetHolly]

Thanks Sweet Holly. :)
You're welcome! And your avatar is very cool! 8)

[DonFan]

Welcome to The Border, JoeFan!

[moonrambler]

This is total speculation, but I'm guessing the song Desperado is one they are proud of and possessive of, and they know it's one of their best and it's also personal, and also because of the subject matter -- for all these reasons, I think they didn't like Joe performing it because he was always wasted. I imagine it bugged the heck out of them to be told about cringe-worthy drunk performances of Desperado.

[Ive always been a dreamer]

That makes perfect sense to me, MR. I do believe that Don and Glenn are very proud of the song given that not only is it the last song in Eagles shows, but they both close with it during their solo performances as well. And I can't speak for the live shows, but as I said before, Joe's drunken, wasted version on the Stern show didn't exactly do the song justice, so I can understand why Don and Glenn would have preferred that he not do it.

[sodascouts]

JoeFan - welcome! I certainly can't know if there was tension or not. If I were Glenn, I might not have laughed too hard at that joke, but you're right in that Joe kids around a lot. However, a few months later, Glenn was declaring that except for Tim, who was a "sweetheart," the Eagles were "not fun guys" - and he added no "just kidding" after it.

MR - I see what you're saying. Do you think that if Joe had been able to do the song justice, that Glenn and Don would have been OK with it? He did seem to have a bad habit of forgetting some of the words.

[JoeFan]

Certainly wasn't one of Joe's finer moments. Can't argue with that.

[SweetHolly]

This is total speculation, but I'm guessing the song Desperado is one they are proud of and possessive of, and they know it's one of their best and it's also personal, and also because of the subject matter -- for all these reasons, I think they didn't like Joe performing it because he was always wasted. I imagine it bugged the heck out of them to be told about cringe-worthy drunk performances of Desperado.
I agree with you on the part of them being proud and possessive of it. I think they are that way about it because Desperado and Tequila Sunrise were the first 2 songs Don and Glenn ever wrote together and that's when they became a song-writing team.

[sodascouts]

It's very interesting that as we have this discussion, GEF posted an article mentioning a very different performance of Desperado by Joe:

https://www.eaglesonlinecentral.com/forum/showthread.php?t=413

I'm sure that more than makes up for the versions that initially drew Glenn and Don's ire, wouldn't you say?

[moonrambler]

I would think too that Glenn & Don don't have a problem with Joe doing the song these days and especially under those circumstances. Soda -- it's like you were asking -- I think if Joe had been able to do the song justice when he performed it in concert, they might not have minded. And that interview you mention where Glenn says the other Eagles are not fun guys, he specifically singles Joe out. I figure Glenn's life had changed, he'd had enough of the constant party, and I think we probably all know how when you get tired of all that, that the guy who IS the party starts to seem kind of obnoxious.

[sodascouts]

How ironic that when they mended fences and started performing together, it was dubbed the "Party of Two" lol.

[Ive always been a dreamer]

That must be when they turned into fun guys again. :D

[Freypower]

I would think too that Glenn & Don don't have a problem with Joe doing the song these days and especially under those circumstances. Soda -- it's like you were asking -- I think if Joe had been able to do the song justice when he performed it in concert, they might not have minded. And that interview you mention where Glenn says the other Eagles are not fun guys, he specifically singles Joe out. I figure Glenn's life had changed, he'd had enough of the constant party, and I think we probably all know how when you get tired of all that, that the guy who IS the party starts to seem kind of obnoxious.

Which makes Glenn's 'Joe WAS the party' line in the F1 interviews somewhat ironic. I always thought the two of them got on the best (I am leaving Glenn/Don Henley out of this). It never occurred to me that Glenn might have got tired of Joe's - shall we say - antics.

[katherine5832]

I know that the original question about the origins of this song was posted about 6 months ago, but I thought I'd post what Don had to say in the "Very Best Of" booklet:

Don: One of my favorites. At that time, all the girls were wearing Charles Jourdan shoes - the ones with the little ankle straps. They'd become very popular and we were big fans [laughs]. And so, we said, "Well, it's not enough just to write about that; we have to turn it into a metaphor for women standing on their own two feet, so to speak, and taking responsibility for their own lives, their own losses." That was our intent. The lyric "Once you've started wearing those shoes" meant "Once you've started being your own woman and taking responsibility for your own life; once you've decided not to be just decoration - an appendage to some guy - then this is all the crap you're going to have to put up with in conjunction with that." Anyone who decides to become the master of his or her own destiny always has to put up with a lot of crap. On the surface the song was about the singles scene: the beautiful, young women seemingly unaware of the sharks waiting in the shallows...sharks that sometimes included us. It was also a great, great beat. It gave Felder a chance to strap on the talkbox, a device which Joe Walsh pioneered on "Rocky Mountain Way" - and the two of them soloed together...

[Share1967]

I thought by now it was common knowledge that HOTM is about Maren Jensen.

The next question is has Joe, whose relationship with Stevie was deeper and longer lasting, ever written any songs about her? I know she wrote at least two for him.

I knew Joe dated Stevie, but I didnt know it was a longer relationship than Don and hers. I love all the info I am finding out. :o

[Share1967]

Since we were talking about Maren Jensen earlier in this thread, I remembered that I read a more recent quote from Don about Maren. It was from an interview done with Timothy White in Billboard magazine in 2000, promoting Inside Job:

Timothy: "But knowing many women you’ve dated for a long time, I’m aware that you’re very loyal to them and they speak well of you."

Don: "I know what you mean. I am good friends with most of my exes. And sometimes it took several years to get back to that point with those people, but if you love somebody they become part of your life. Especially in Maren’s case. We went through a lot together, and we’re still very close friends, and she’s about to have a baby any day now, and my wife and I are gonna have one any day now, too [Julia Sophia Henley, Don and the former Sharon Summerall’s third child, was born two days after this interview.] She and her husband are doing very well, and I helped her get her business off the ground, and now they’ve just sold it to Estee Lauder, and she’s fixed for the rest of her life. But my life has changed, too. I finally woke up one day and took a look around and said to myself, “I don’t want to be the last guy at the party. It’s too sad.” The guy with the lampshade on after the party is not me, and I snapped out of it. And the universe responded in kind and sent me Sharon. [The couple married in 1995.] And then the kids came [including a daughter, Annabel, and a son, Will] and that really changed everything. So these songs are heartfelt, although some may scoff. But that’s OK."


Wow!! Isnt that sweet. I think if I was his wife Sharon, I would stick to him like fabric softener. :D She must be very secure in their love. Sweet! :D

[Share1967]

What is the story about Joe's daughter Emma? I wonder who was ummmm...more impressionable to Stevie, Joe or Don? :wink: :D

[glenneaglesfan]

Interesting thought, Share. Soda posted part of an interview Stevie gave earlier this year. It's here.

https://eaglesonlinecentral.com/forum/showpost.php?p=17168&postcount=33

"There are the great loves of your life, [Stevie] says, then there are the loves of your life, and then there are the companions of your life - 'there's all the different kind of love affairs that you have. But all the great loves of my life wouldn't have been any better at settling down than me.'

And who has been the greatest love of her life?

'My great, great love was Joe Walsh.'

Joe Walsh? Of the Eagles? I struggle to keep the note of surprise out of my voice.

'It's crazy, isn't it?'

I am no expert on Nicks's romantic adventures, but I've done my research. Her affairs with Buckingham, Fleetwood, Don Henley, the record executive Jimmy Iovine - all are well chronicled. But nowhere have I found a single reference to Joe Walsh.

'1983 to 1986,' Nicks says crisply. 'I don't know - why do you love somebody? Why do you love them so much that when they walk in the room your heart jumps out of your chest? I don't know. But I fell in love with Joe at first sight from across the room, in the bar at the Mansions Hotel in Dallas. I looked at him and I walked across the room and I sat on the bar stool next to him, and two seconds later I crawled into his lap, and that was it.

'We were probably the perfect, complete, crazy pair. He was the one that I would have married, and that I would probably have changed my life around for…' She pauses. 'A little bit. Not a lot. But he wouldn't have changed his life either.'

The reason they broke up, she says, is that they were both 'really seriously drug addicts. We were a couple on the way to hell.'

The relationship finally ended when Walsh got on a plane and went to Australia 'to get away from me, basically. He thought - or so I'm told by my friends that Joe told - that one of us was going to die, and the other person would not be able to save them. And I did think I was going to die, absolutely. It took me a long, long time to get over it - if I ever got over it. Because there was no other man in the world for me. And it's the same today, even though Joe is married and has two sons. He met somebody in rehab and got married. And I think he's happy.'"

[sodascouts]

To answer your question about Emma - she died in a car accident in Colorado on her way to kindergarten. This was in 1974. Joe wrote "Song for Emma" as a goodbye for her, and Stevie wrote "Has Anyone Ever Written Anything for You" in sympathy for Joe's loss, after he showed her a little water fountain he erected in honor of Emma in her favorite park. She had always complained that the water fountains were too high for her to reach, so Joe built one her size in her memory.

This is from an interview with Bill Szymczyk:

"A simple plaque adorns the water fountain in North Boulder Park: 'This fountain is given in loving memory of Emma Walsh. April 29, 1971, to April 1, 1974.'

Walsh and former wife Stephanie donated the water fountain to the park in 1976 because it was a favorite playspot of their daughter, who died in a car accident. Walsh's 'So What?' album also included another tribute, 'Song for Emma.'

'Joe was on the road constantly, and when he'd get off he'd spend more time in L.A. than he would in Colorado,' Szymczyk said.

'When Emma died, that put the period on the whole deal. Stephanie went to pieces, and so did he, and so did I - I was her godfather, in the hospital when they had to take her off life support. That was a very dark time.

'Very shortly after that, Joe was permanently gone (from Colorado).'

[TimothyBFan]

All I can say is WOW!!!! I have been an Eagles fan for decades now and have always loved Fleetwood Mac and Stevie also (have all the albums -but never read the liner notes I guess)-How in the world did I miss all this?!? I have so many questions and don't know where to start.
1) When did Stevie and Joe have this relationship and for how long?
2) Now that my curiosity is peeked -are there any biographies about Stevie that would be good to read? I love rock and roll biographies and have collected several about many artist but nothing on Fleetwood Mac or Stevie.
3) Do any of you feel the same way I do now after reading this -wouldn't you just love to see them get back together and live happily ever after (sorry to Joes current wife who I am sure is wonderful).
4) How many more of these kind of stories are there out there (or even on this board) that I have missed?

Enlighten me some more anyone :!: :!: :!: :!:

[sodascouts]

1) When did Stevie and Joe have this relationship and for how long?

It lasted about three years, from 1983-1986. They met when Joe opened for Stevie on her Wild Heart tour.


2) Now that my curiosity is peeked -are there any biographies about Stevie that would be good to read? I love rock and roll biographies and have collected several about many artist but nothing on Fleetwood Mac or Stevie.

There are no good Stevie bios, IMHO. There have been several books on Fleetwood Mac, including an old authorized biography from the 70s. Mick Fleetwood also wrote an autobiography.


3) Do any of you feel the same way I do now after reading this -wouldn't you just love to see them get back together and live happily ever after (sorry to Joes current wife who I am sure is wonderful).

Stevie got her facts off when she said Joe was happily married. He is divorced from his third wife and is currently dating Marjorie Bach, most famous for being Ringo Starr's sister-in-law.

In romance-dreamworld, I would want Stevie to get back with Lindsey Buckingham and live happily ever after - but he's married so that's off. S&L's romance is far more epic - they met in high school and still write songs about each other to this day. She has called Lindsey her "Great Love" before, but when she's mad at him, suddenly it's Joe. lol I'm not trying to diminish what she had with Joe - he was right up there with Lindsey.

I'm afraid Don never made her "Great Love" list, but they remain close to this day, unlike Stevie and Joe. For all her gushing about Joe, they do not interact much and obviously, she doesn't really keep track of what's going on in his life (hence the gaffe about him being happily married).


4) How many more of these kind of stories are there out there (or even on this board) that I have missed?

That's impossible to answer - guess you'll have to do some more reading!

[DonFan]

I'm afraid Don never made her "Great Love" list, but they remain close to this day.
:sigh: Stevie needs some help making out her lists.
I can tell you one thing--Don would definitely be at the top of MINE.

[sodascouts]

Agreed, DF!

[Mrs Henley]

Totaly agreed DF!

[Lilyeye]

Hi everyone. I usually lurk here, but felt compelled to sign up and jump in. I'm a huge Stevie fan and got into the Eagles when I heard "Leather and Lace." I am still fairly new to them and their music. Anyway while Don and Stevie did date, she never talked about him the way she did Joe and Lindsey Buckingham. I think her relationship with Don is kinda similar to her relationship with Tom Petty. They have great chemistry on stage;she absolutely loves and adores them and considers them very great and close friends. However, it doesn't go beyond that. So I don't think Don's wife has anything to worry about. However, judging from Stevie's interviews she still carries a torch for Joe.

Oh and about "Sara," according to Stevie, part of that song is also about Mick Fleetwood. Particularly the "Great Dark Wing." She had an affair with him for two years after she dated Don. Stevie's songwriting is interesting that way because she creates hybrid songs that can be about one or more people. Here's some quotes from her

Sara was pretty much about Mick. So, he was the 'great dark wing'. And, ah, it was about everything that was going on at that particular time, too, but he was the, the reason for the, you know, the beginning of it.
~Stevie Nicks, MTV Fanatic, 1998

[On whether the line in the song Sara, 'When you build your house, I'll come by' is about Don Henley, whom she was dating at the time?] (laughs) That is true. He did [build the house]. And I was in it before he finished it.
~Stevie Nicks, Us magazine, July 1990

I knew that Sara would be very popular because I loved writing that song. I've had more fun writing that...I remember the night I wrote it. 'I sat up with a very good friend of mine whose name is Sara, who was married to Mick Fleetwood. She likes to think it's completely about her, but it's really not completely about her. It's about me, about her, about Mick, about Fleetwood Mac. Its about all of us at that point. There's little bits about each one of us in that song and when it had all the other verses it really covered a vast bunch of people. Sara was the kind of song you could fall in love with, because I fell in love with it...
~Stevie Nicks, Tommy Vance show, May 1994

[Lilyeye]

Welcome from me, too, moonrambler! Glad to have ya! :D

I was shocked to learn that Stevie had had a relationship with Joe. I'd always known about her and Don, but not about Joe. And I'm glad it never caused any friction between Joe and Don. Or did it?

I don't think their relationship caused friction between Joe and Don. Because her relationship with Don wasn't as intense or deep. If there was, she has never mentioned it. Now there was tension in Fleetwood Mac when Stevie was with both Lindsey Buckingham and later Mick Fleetwood.

[Lilyeye]

1) When did Stevie and Joe have this relationship and for how long?

It lasted about three years, from 1983-1986. They met when Joe opened for Stevie on her Wild Heart tour.


2) Now that my curiosity is peeked -are there any biographies about Stevie that would be good to read? I love rock and roll biographies and have collected several about many artist but nothing on Fleetwood Mac or Stevie.

There are no good Stevie bios, IMHO. There have been several books on Fleetwood Mac, including an old authorized biography from the 70s. Mick Fleetwood also wrote an autobiography.


3) Do any of you feel the same way I do now after reading this -wouldn't you just love to see them get back together and live happily ever after (sorry to Joes current wife who I am sure is wonderful).

Stevie got her facts off when she said Joe was happily married. He is divorced from his third wife and is currently dating Marjorie Bach, most famous for being Ringo Starr's sister-in-law.

In romance-dreamworld, I would want Stevie to get back with Lindsey Buckingham and live happily ever after - but he's married so that's off. S&L's romance is far more epic - they met in high school and still write songs about each other to this day. She has called Lindsey her "Great Love" before, but when she's mad at him, suddenly it's Joe. lol I'm not trying to diminish what she had with Joe - he was right up there with Lindsey.

I'm afraid Don never made her "Great Love" list, but they remain close to this day, unlike Stevie and Joe. For all her gushing about Joe, they do not interact much and obviously, she doesn't really keep track of what's going on in his life (hence the gaffe about him being happily married).


4) How many more of these kind of stories are there out there (or even on this board) that I have missed?

That's impossible to answer - guess you'll have to do some more reading!

LOL I totally agree with your answers. There really aren't any good Stevie bios, which sucks. I couldn't agree more about the Lindsey, Stevie and Joe thing. For the longest time Lindsey was her great love. Then all of a sudden she is calling Joe her great love lol. I guess we can just assume that both men created a huge impact on her.

[Share1967]

This just blows my mind. I had Don and Stevie in my mind as a great love, with great chemistry. It is hard to imagine Joe being greater than Don. He must of rocked her world more than just musically. How weird...I am glad it doesnt appear to cause any friction between Don and Joe. :D :D

[Angel]

It's not as if Joe is better than Don, it's more like that at the time Stevie was dating Don it was anything but serious. When she was dating Joe it was very serious. Maybe she just doesn't want to call an on-again, off-again fling with Don a Great Love.

I agree that it would be ideal for Stevie to get back with Lindsey, but her and Don would've been a good couple too if things had gotten more serious. They sure get along well! They had great chemistry on the Two Voices tour. I also thought it was weird that Stevie went from calling Lindsey her soulmate to calling Joe her soulmate!

But it MUST be weird for Don and Joe if the subject of Stevie ever comes up!

Oh, and I think Miss Ghost is totally about Stevie!

[DonFan]

Angel, I don't think Miss Ghost is totally about Stevie. Over the years Don has had serious relationships with several women, most notably actress Maren Jensen, so I think that song refers to Stevie, Maren, and several of the lovely ladies in his past.

[Angel]

That makes sense. It just reminded me of Stevie is all I meant.