Glenn and Joni Mitchell

[Molly]

Bob Seger's Still The Same, which is about a gambler (see Desperado) is also about Glenn, I am reliably informed. I always thought this was the case. Glenn was Seger's protege but really became a much bigger star than 'honest journeyman' Seger.

Now, of course, this could be Seeger's attempt to keep an air of mystery about the song, but this is what Seeger says about "Still the Same" in the notes accompanying his "Greatest Hits" CD -


"People have asked me for years who it's about. It's an amalgamation of characters I met when I first went to Hollywood. All "Type A" personalities: overachieving, driven."

[Freypower]

It's entirely possible that my 'reliable' informant about this was drawing a long bow here. Bob is, however, being cagey. All songwriters like to keep the anonymity of the song's subject to a certain degree. It's just that it's always struck me as how Bob might regard the trajectory of Glenn's career. There is also some unconscious autobiography in Hollywood Nights, also from the Stranger In Town album.

We talk about songs about Glenn, but has it struck you that in his own songs he doesn't do a lot of self-analysis? An interesting possible exception may be in This Way To Happiness where he talks about searching, and never really being free. Does anyone want to suggest other examples where he might be trying to reveal something about himself? POMPOY? (I'm running out of time)? Is Big Life a sort of parody of his own life? Think of it - he mentions Aspen, LA and Hawaii in the song.


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There's talk on the street, it sounds so familiar
Great expectations, everybody's watching you

[sodascouts]

I'm always tempted to read a lot of self-analysis into songs, although it's more difficult when they're co-written. He dedicates "That Girl" to Janie, his first wife, in the liner notes of No Fun Aloud. I've thought it was perhaps recollecting what it's like to tour and miss your girl, although I don't know much about those two so I don't know how much touring he did while they were together.

Ironically, besides the title track, Soul Searchin' doesn't yield too many songs where his soul gets searched. "Livin' Right" is also autobiographical, but obviously, not so much about mind as body - although he does connect the two in the song.

We know that "River of Dreams" is somewhat autobiographical. However, it really seems to touch on surface realities as opposed to a lot of introspection, other than the feeling of escape from a life of drudgery. Considering he was doing what he loved for a living - making music - I wonder what he was escaping from? Everyone's expectations of him to be the "rock star" when he wanted to live a quiet life? The shallowness and excesses of Hollywood types? Smog? lol

But yeah, he does seem to be more about characters and scenarios than about "This is my life." A key difference between him and someone like Stevie Nicks.


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[glenneaglesfan]

I have thought that the line you refer to in POMPOY could symbolise how he feels about being with a younger woman (and possibly about coming late to fatherhood). I've Got Mine, although not exactly autobiographical, gives some insight into how he feels about the disparity between wealth and poverty, and how little many rich people give back to society. Personally I think he himself has given an enormous amount back, both materially with his charity work and inspirationally with his sheer enthusiasm and energy for performing.


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This way to happiness...

[sodascouts]

I think "Big Life" is definitely, in some places, a parody of himself - in others, it's more of a parody of the kind of people he sees around him (like the line about owning the airplane and all that). For a while I thought "Don" was Don Henley but then figured out it was much more probably Donald Trump.

One of the things I love about "I've Got Mine" is the way he applies it to himself in the end. You have him describing rich people who don't care, but then admitting at the end that he's culpable in his own way. I know I've said this before, but that's the kind of thing that makes him rise above the "preachy" judgmental types who like to talk about what everyone else is doing wrong when perhaps they should do a little soul-searchin' themselves. lol


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[Freypower]

'Don' in Big Life is Don Johnson. And Glenn does own a private jet - a Citation 5.

I don't think he's referring to himself at the end of I've Got Mine. He has a specific character, as he does in Big Life and Love in the 21st Century. He's telling the story from this rich man's viewpoint. I think it would be too big a leap for him to suddenly include himself in the song. He does more than make small donations and feel vaguely guilty.


~~~

There's talk on the street, it sounds so familiar
Great expectations, everybody's watching you

[Ive always been a dreamer]

Okay girls - this is a very cool thread. I have really learned a lot here. I never knew that Glenn and Joni had an affair - a few one night stands would not have surprized me though. So, obviously I never knew the songs were about Glenn. It's also very interesting about Seger's "Still the Same."

As far as Don and Glenn's relationship at the time Glenn called it quits for the band - in everything I've read, I think Don was very hurt at the time. Glenn was relieved to be out. Obviously, there were bitter feelings and I think both of them took opportunities over the years to take shots at the other. I've always said I would love to know the entire story of their true relationship, but it is very unlikely that we ever will get to hear it. Fortunately, time, maturity, and forgiveness all intravened. IMO, in spite of any differences they may have now, I really believe that deep down they have a great deal of love, respect, and admiration for each other.


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I'm just a hired hand working on the dreams I plan to try. The days go by...

[sodascouts]

'Don' in Big Life is Don Johnson. And Glenn does own a private jet - a Citation 5.

Don Johnson! Never would have guessed that. As far as the plane thing, though, the plane is the song is not a private one. Or if it is the girl he is picking up is very stupid because she apparently has to be told he owns the private jet. lol

As far as him doing more than making small donations, I think he's attempting to do a self-incrimination in the larger sense there too - as in "We're all guilty, including me." Don't you think it would be odd for him to suddenly switch from talking about rich men to doing it from the rich man's point of view? Or from saying there's no guilt to some guilt? Obviously this is up for interpretation and there is no "right" or "wrong" answer.


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[sodascouts]

IMO, in spite of any differences they may have now, I really believe that deep down they have a great deal of love, respect, and admiration for each other.

I agree.


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[Freypower]

I just think the way he says 'I can't take care of everyone/now that I've got mine' is the rich man's attempt to defend himself from what has been said about him going by in his limousine (and that part was sung from the viewpoint of the non-famous people: 'they don't see us looking back'). So is the house of cards thing. I honestly don't think that's Glenn talking about himself. Then the fact that he then switches to the 'moral malnutrition' bit indicates that he's now passing judgment on this man whose mentality he has just described. I think the idea that Glenn is including himself here is taking it too literally.


~~~

There's talk on the street, it sounds so familiar
Great expectations, everybody's watching you