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Thread: Glenn to be Guest at Songwriters Hall of Fame Master Session at NYU

  1. #51
    Moderator Troubadour's Avatar
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    Default Re: Glenn to be Guest at Songwriters Hall of Fame Master Session at NYU

    Those of you who got to attend this talk are really lucky! It must have been great to see Glenn in a different setting, talking in-depth about his career and influences. It's very fitting with the band's anniversary coming up. Thanks for your detailed summaries, HH - we really appreciate your note-taking efforts!

    I love the old stories about the Troubadour days and the '70s LA scene... a talented group of young singer-songwriters hanging around together, breeding creativity. One of those magical moments in music history that would spawn a whole legacy of amazing musicians and timeless songs. Not that they would have known that at the time, of course.


    you better put it all behind you, baby, 'cause life goes on
    you keep carrying that anger, it'll eat you up inside--



  2. #52
    Administrator sodascouts's Avatar
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    Default Re: Glenn to be Guest at Songwriters Hall of Fame Master Session at NYU

    Yes, thank you so much, HH. Just reading this is bringing back great memories.

    Seeing Glenn in this setting talking about his experiences and songwriting process was very cool and despite the copious amount of research I've done on the guys and Glenn in particular, even I heard some new stories. Of course, hearing "It's Your World Now" for perhaps the only time it has ever been performed live was very thrilling!!!

    Last night I intended to write some about this as well but when I got home, I fell asleep and didn't wake up until 7:00 am this morning. I guess I needed to catch up on my sleep - October has been a pretty crazy month for me! I'll try again tonight after I get back from work (gotta leave soon in fact).

    I thought this would be my last Eagles-related adventure for a while, but now that Timothy has announced dates..... too bad I can't afford Vegas!

    Always in our hearts, Never forgotten

  3. #53
    Administrator sodascouts's Avatar
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    Default Re: Glenn to be Guest at Songwriters Hall of Fame Master Session at NYU

    BTW I thought "It's Your World Now" was especially appropriate considering it was done as part of a university series. Some of the students who attended may be the hit songwriters of tomorrow!

    Always in our hearts, Never forgotten

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    Moderator Glennsallnighter's Avatar
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    Default Re: Glenn to be Guest at Songwriters Hall of Fame Master Session at NYU

    So true Soda! October has indeed been busy for you. But worth it I'm sure. Looking forward to hearing your 'review' of Tuesday evening. Hope youre feeling refreshed, and that you have a good day!
    'I must be leaving soon... its your world now'
    Glenn Frey 1948-2016 RIP

  5. #55
    Stuck on the Border Henley Honey's Avatar
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    Default Re: Glenn to be Guest at Songwriters Hall of Fame Master Session at NYU

    And, yet more . . . .

    The discussion continued about songwriting. Glenn talked about there being a big transition from being a songwriter and somebody playing live to being a recording artist. "It's a very different animal."
    In the studio its just you, an engineer maybe a few roadies and a tape machine and you have to figure out a way to put excitement on tape without an audience to feed off of. "You become more microscopic. You don't want it too rushed. Time and groove become more important".

    He said that around the time they made their third album is when he thought they really started to get better as songwriters and also get better at making records. "After we wrote Desperado and Tequilla Sunrise, the criteria for us was if we played this for Jackson what would he think? If we played this for Neil Young would he think it was a good song? If we played it for Joni Mitchell would she like it or would there be a long silence which is always a sign of negation?". He talked about about how they started to feel like they were going to be OK. That he and Don had good chemistry.

    They talked about Desperado not selling as many copies as the first album. Glenn said: "It was about being an artist too. It wasn't just about trying to sell records. It was about trying to do something that was valid -- something that was important."

    Glenn was asked how he felt about other artists covering their songs. He said it was hard to cover Eagles songs. There hadn't been too many covers because their versions were the definitive versions. He thought Linda's version of Desperado was great as was the Gypsy Kings version of Hotel California. He also liked Vince Gill's version of I Can't Tell You Why.

    They discussed the discipline and focus needed for writing. How the Eagles had put out an album a year for 5 years while simultaneously touring. Glenn said "We were young. We were excited. We were getting better. The one thing about having a hit record is that it tells you that you're doing something right and that you can just focus on what you can start doing better. For about 2 years, Don and I just could not do anything wrong."

    He talked about making the album One Of These Nights. "That was when we really started to gel. We knew we were good. We knew what we were doing was good. I often tell young songwriters to find a songwriting partner. Two things happen when you write by yourself. You fall in love with your own voice and your own words and you can't really be critical about it cause you think it all sounds wonderful -- or you get very paranoid and don't think anything is good enough and you worry yourself to death."

    He talked about how Don and he had enough mutual respect for each other that they could sit down and write a song and not be offended if the other did not like a suggestion made by the other. How they had a good checks and balance system with each other. Same with Jack Tempchin. He talked about how it helped to be working with people you trust. He likened the writing relationship to a marriage. You have to find the right fit and that with trust and mutual respect comes the courage to write songs.

    He talked about the Troubadour and how they came to write Lyin Eyes. How it was the story of this triangle between the singer with the heart of gold and the rich sugar daddy and the beautiful girl caught in between.
    "We wrote Lyin Eyes in 2 days. It's a song with 8 verses that is 7 to 8 minutes long and we actually had more lyrics than we used. The story just worked. We wrote it fast."

    Glenn talked about what a great high voice Randy had but that he never had a hit record so they decided to write TITTL for him which was the Eagles first million-selling single. "It just sort of felt like we knew what we were doing. We knew the rules. We knew what was good and what wasn't good and we weren't afraid to go in there and just have at it."

    They talked about the unusual structure of One Of These Nights. They played the intro and the beginning of the song. Glenn said: "That's my favorite Eagles record. We almost called the OOTN album Black In The Saddle because we felt we were getting a little more R&B into our music, moving a little bit away from Country Rock on some songs."
    "We had Don Henley who was one of the great singers of our time and he's got the kind of voice that can sing R&B".

    Glenn told the story of how he and Don had written OOTN and were to meet up with the band in Miami and go into the studio. Randy got stuck in a snowstorm in Cleveland and got delayed so they started without him. That is how Don Felder came to pick up the bass and write the intro on OOTN. Glenn also said that OOTN was originally written on the piano.

    They discussed the "simple but innovative structure" of the song.
    "It just felt right. Sometimes the songs take over and they tell you what to write. Sometimes it's not always you doing it. There are no rules in songwriting other than it's gotta sound cool. It can't sound forced. It needs to be natural. Respect the song. Understand what it says. Respect the vocal."

    He talked about how a song isn't finished until the record is mixed and gave the example of OOTN. How they had the line -- I've been searching for the daughter of the devil himself -- but that they didn't have the line searching for an angel in white for about 3-4 weeks until a friend/producer suggested it.

    Continuing the discussion about how a song is really never done, Glenn talked about how Don as a lyric writer would never give up -- even when his lead vocals were done. "He'd come back in and say I wan't to try it this way and he'd try new lyrics." They used the phrase "Hidden Deeper Meaning". How they would try and squeeze more meaning into the song. "Something personal".

    "Songwriting is about getting big ideas into small places. You're not writing a novel with vivid descriptions. Sometimes you can't say everthing you want to say. Sometimes what you leave out is just as important as what you leave in. Never explain everything. I think that's a big mistake."

    He said: "One of the greatest allies that you have as an artist is the imagination of your audience -- of finding a way to draw them in -- to have them identify with this piece of material so that it's them, not you. It's them. They're the guy in Lyin Eyes. They're the guy in BOML. You want to get people involved. You can't do that if you're just gonna explain everything. People need to be tricked into enlightenment."

    He continued: "As a songwriter, the one thing you have to do is show up. I don't wirte songs all the time, but I carry around titles with me. I carry around ideas and then when it comes time for songwriting you need to do it everyday." He talked about how he used to think songs came from "up here" meaning the air, but now thinks they come from the subconscious "cause that's where you've read all the books, listened to the music, chords and stories. It's all in your subconscious. You have to get yourself ready and oiled enough to let that stuff flow out."


    That's all I time for now. More later. . . . .
    Last edited by Henley Honey; 10-27-2011 at 09:28 PM.

  6. #56
    Stuck on the Border
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    Default Re: Glenn to be Guest at Songwriters Hall of Fame Master Session at NYU

    That's really an in depth look at the way they wrote songs but I am glad they didn't call the OOTN album 'Black In The Saddle'. Despite Glenn's enthusiasm for the title track, the album is my least favourite Eagles album because the songs NOT written by himself & Don were quite frankly not as good. I didn't know the third person in the Lyin' Eyes triangle was 'the singer with the heart of gold'. Does he mean himself? I never thought of it, even though it originated in the Troubadour, as being about an 'industry' relationship.

    My only complaint with all this is he doesn't talk much about how doing his own lead vocals influenced the way songs were written; he only talks about Don's vocals. I know he's being modest & he doesn't want to blow his own trumpet. The only part I could find which I thought may apply to him too is 'respect the vocal'.

  7. #57
    Stuck on the Border Henley Honey's Avatar
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    Default Re: Glenn to be Guest at Songwriters Hall of Fame Master Session at NYU

    He mentioned that once they had some money, they went up the block from the Troubadour to Dan Tana's restaurant and hang out there. They'd introduce themselves to these beautiful women who'd stay till 1 AM and then go home to their rich sugar daddy boyfriends. That was the context of the triangle.

  8. #58
    Stuck on the Border Henley Honey's Avatar
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    Default Re: Glenn to be Guest at Songwriters Hall of Fame Master Session at NYU

    It continued . . . .

    "I've had moments where I've written songs when I wasn't even aware of starting the song." He uses two songs written with Jack Tempchin as an example. They were writing "The One You Love" and Glenn started talking about a sax riff that he had and he described it for Jack. Jack "got it" and they wrote "I Found Somebody" out of the blue.

    On songwriting, he added:
    "I love the self exploration. I love a little bit of the pain and suffering that must go into it, but I also love the fact that it is never the same. It's always different." He talked about each song having its own personality and said, "It's like with your kids. They are of you but they're not you. Some get written fast. Some take time. Some never get finished and I like that. I'm still amazed. I'm never disappointed. Sometimes the title comes first, sometimes the chords come first. Sometimes the title".

    He went on to tell the story of how Life In The Fast Lane came about.
    "I'm in the San Fernando Valley and its 1975. We used to play alot of poker in those days and we used to do alot of drugs. I'm riding in a Corvette with a drug dealer and we're riding on the Ventura Freeway and I know he has drugs in his briefcase. I'm sitting shotgun in this little 'Vette and he's all the sudden doing 85 mph in the left lane of the Ventura Freeway. I'm like -- what are you doin' man? He looks at me as says -- Life in the Fast Lane. So I said to myself -- now that's a song."

    He told Don about it and while they were rehearsing in Stone Canyon at Randy's house. Joe played a lick warming up and Glenn told Don -- That's it. That's LITFL. He said they had a good story in mind of a young couple who had it all -- jet set lifestyle, fast cars and parties but ultimately found that an empty life. None of those things could satisfy the couple. He felt the song was perfect for Hotel California which he considered a "dark record".


    to be continued . . . Anybody getting sick of this or should I keep going?
    Last edited by Henley Honey; 10-27-2011 at 06:10 PM.

  9. #59
    Stuck on the Border VAisForEagleLovers's Avatar
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    Default Re: Glenn to be Guest at Songwriters Hall of Fame Master Session at NYU

    I want to read more and I was there!
    VK

    You can't change the world but you can change yourself.

  10. #60
    Stuck on the Border
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    Default Re: Glenn to be Guest at Songwriters Hall of Fame Master Session at NYU

    No, HH, this is absolutely perfect. Although I have heard a lot of these stories in other forms, you are telling them the way Glenn told them, and that is important. In any case I hadn't heard the 'self exploration' part. I'm finding out more & more about him the more you write & you are doing it very well indeed.

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