WTF??

[Freypower]

The fact of the matter is that song-writing credits are a big deal when it comes to musicians. They are official, agreed-upon, representations of work and creativity. It is a standard practice for listing order to represent the significance of contribution, as was the case with Hotel California. So, for Frey and/or Henley to rearrange the order of the credits for Hotel California on HFO, behind Felder's back, is unethical. Sorry folks, it is what it is.

I'm trying to imagine what the reaction would be like if the credit order had been Henely, Frey, and Felder and then Felder had somehow conspired to rearrange the order to Felder, Henley, and Frey. Would people be saying Henley and Frey should just "get over it?" I kinda doubt it.

As far as Frey deserving a higher position due to his suggestion of the rearrangement, that's just flat out invalid.

• They did not rewrite the song; they rearranged it - although Felder did write a new introduction. The writing credits for the song should not change. If anything, Felder could argue that the introduction should be credited separately.
• If I suggest you write a song and then you go write a song, do I deserve more credit for the song than you? No, I don't deserve any of the song-writing credit. Frey made the suggestion of the acoustic version, Felder did all the writing associated with the version.
• If another band had published that version of Hotel California, would they have been justified in listing their names ahead of Felder, Henley and Frey as writers of the song? No, they would not.
• Even if you buy into the idea that Frey's suggestion entitles him to be higher on the credit list (which, again, is invalid), there is no justification for moving Henley's name ahead of Felder's name.

As for the point that this only happened on HFO, I would like to point out that I have purchased the published music for the Hotel California album. The title song is credited as: Don Henley, Glenn Frey, and Don Felder.

To put it simply, writing the vast majority of the music for Hotel California is the most significant professional accomplishment in Don Felder's life (in my estimation). If, years after the fact, your co-workers conspired behind your back to change the representation of your most significant accomplishment so as to minimize your contribution, I wonder how you would react. I suspect: not well...

How was it 'behind his back'? He was in the band at the time. He presumably could have objected & didn't.

You say you have the 'published music'. What do you mean by that? I have the sheet music book. The credits for that read Felder/Henley/Frey.

[Turf]

My understanding is that it happened without him being aware of it. Nobody consulted him - the powers that be just changed it.

The music I'm referring to is this book, which was published in 2006 or 2007.

[Freypower]

My understanding is that it happened without him being aware of it. Nobody consulted him - the powers that be just changed it.

The music I'm referring to is this book, which was published in 2006 or 2007.

Presumably permission had to be granted for that book to be published but it's hardly Frey & Henley's fault that whoever was responsible used the HFO credits.

I know people have every right to discuss this stuff, but personally, it is making me tired. These things happened & unfortunately they have to be accepted.

[Turf]

Presumably permission had to be granted for that book to be published but it's hardly Frey & Henley's fault that whoever was responsible used the HFO credits.

Yes, they would have required permission in the form a licensing agreement which would have dictated the terms of use.

I know people have every right to discuss this stuff, but personally, it is making me tired. These things happened & unfortunately they have to be accepted.

You're in good company. I've noticed people seem have one attitude when bashing Felder and another when responding to alternative perspectives...

[VAisForEagleLovers]

I'm glad to hear different opinions. For myself, I talk it all with a grain of salt. Glenn and Don are not evil incarnate and they are not unethical. There was a reason it happened and probably a good one. I find it hard to believe that Felder didn't find out that the credits were rearranged until just before the Probst show nearly twenty years later, but if it really took him that long, then shame on him for not checking something that is obviously held in high regard amongst musicians (it obviously is, I just can't figure out why).

Since I can't believe he didn't notice until a few months ago, the fact that it's not in his book tells me he knows what the reason is and is OK with it. He could have made it part of the lawsuit, yet he didn't. Maybe he was just over it, but then got 'unover it' a few months ago.

[MaryCalifornia]

Turf,

I don't think anyone on this site is an expert in songwriting intellectual property law, I'm certainly not, but I do have a basic understanding of how the rights to a song work. Bottom line is I agree with you. The order of songwriting credits is extremely important. It is a huge deal, it is their livelihood, especially for the lesser-paid members of the band. We had a whole discussion about this in the documentary thread, which started when I noted that Timothy isn't credited first on I Can't Tell You Why. I think the reason this topic gets attention is that Hotel California is such a famous song, and the rift between Felder and the others is so well known, as is the fact that he was the main songwriter on that song. So when someone notices that the credits have changed, the first thought is, "oooh, look what Don and Glenn did" - I think this is a natural reaction. The fact that the credits get messed with at all is just bizarre - this doesn't happen with the Beatles or Rolling Stones songs, especially songs that are really successful and well-known. Or...maybe it does and we've just never noticed it. Just an Eagles anomaly.

[GlennLover]

This is all just speculation so we can't rightfully put the blame on anyone. We don't even know how or why the change was made. We don't know for sure that it wasn't an error that wasn't caught, like Best of My Love appearing in the HFO credits when it wasn't included in the final cut.

[VAisForEagleLovers]

I agree with it being their livelihood and I see it's important to them. Perhaps the grunts who put the things together feel like I do. The things I write (things that are my livelihood) don't get published with my name on them or even the name of the company I work for. It's the customer's name, we just get the money.

I can easily see after thinking about it that it would be important for songwriting. If you know who wrote a song and like it, chances are you'd like other things they wrote. However, I'm an avid listener to music of all types and I never noticed or cared who wrote a song until about ten years ago, and I'll be honest, I still don't care for 98% of the music I listen to. Outside of this message board, I've never met a single person who cared. Harsh, but it's easy to see where those who aren't in the details could have a blase' attitude about it, like whoever did the credits for the documentary.

[MaryCalifornia]

I don't know if this applies to songwriting, doesn't seem like it would, but I thought it was fascinating to learn that the details regarding writing credits for films and TV shows have actually been litigated over the word "and" versus the symbol "&" - they have different meanings when it comes to writing credits. This is why you will see something like: Movie Title, written by Joe Schmo & Some Lady and Some Guy. There is an entire body of law and court cases surrounding this. Joe Schmo and Some Lady share the main credit together, and Some Guy gets secondary credit. I just could't believe there is an industry-accepted legal difference between "and" and "&". Probably not as strict when it comes to songwriting credits.

[Springbo]

For me in general, the music has always been more important than the words. If I don't like the melody, I won't even listen to the song. Just sayin'.