Page 8 of 31 FirstFirst ... 45678910111218 ... LastLast
Results 71 to 80 of 308

Thread: Why I no longer am happy with my favorite band

  1. #71
    Border Desperado Vector's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Posts
    135

    Default Re: Why I no longer am happy with my favorite band

    Quote Originally Posted by sad-cafe View Post
    Felder,,, He is disgruntled and comes off as a whiner and he just needs to "get over it"
    I am not sure what you are basing this on?

    He seemed to come across ok in the Doc for the most part, and reading his book went even further to humanize him. Now there is no way of knowing how skewed his perspective is in his book, but much of it matches up with the Doc and other books. Heck I was amazed at the detail he recalls from those days, since all of the Eagles were drinking and doing drugs along the way. I think the only one that cleaned up was L-eadon toward the end. When I watched the Doc for the second time, it seemed as if they used portions of the Felder book as cliff notes. There were some details that I find strange that so many of them were able to recall, considering their altered states.

    Now if Felder lost the lawsuit, or it was settled for little more than the cost of lawyers, I'd have to assume his complaints were merit-less, and petty. However he does make a case for improper conflicts of interest, special treatment Henley and Frey were getting at the expense of everyone, etc.

    That is not to say his view is 100% right. However if even 50% was accurate, it still looks bad. I actually started to feel for the guy because I know people with his type of personality. Some people are in your face, and intend to resolve the issue one way or the other. Others are totally passive, and go along to get along, even if they are not happy about it. Felder is one of these guys who was typically not confrontational, but spoke up about things he was not happy with every once in a while. He allowed himself to be put off by Azoff on a regular basis, always hoping he would get answers to his questions. Instead of making demands or letting it go, he allowed it to eat him up over time, which prompted a periodic complaint or question Henley/Frey/Azoff didn't want to deal with.

    `

  2. #72
    Border Desperado Vector's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Posts
    135

    Default Re: Why I no longer am happy with my favorite band

    Quote Originally Posted by WalshFan88 View Post
    This is a band where the original lineup was NOT the best lineup IMO, nor the most successful. I'll leave it at that.
    This is another one of those interesting perspectives. This is of course based on opinion/preference, so there is no right or wrong way to see it.

    For me, I think I am on the fence. There is no doubt different versions of the Eagles (original 4 vs +Felder vs -two originals +Walsh and Schmit) created different sounds/songs/fans.
    Still you have to give props to the original 4 as most of the songs on their first Greatest Hits album were just those guys and some with Felder.
    Yet there move toward a more R&R band hit it's pinnacle with the addition of Walsh. Though Schmit came more toward the end of 1977, he added a distinct sound which blended about as well as anyone.

    My guess is that fans of the more country sounding Eagles preferred the original guys the best. Others who were more into rock certainly enjoyed the later incarnation.

    `

  3. #73
    Stuck on the Border WalshFan88's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Illinois
    Posts
    11,238

    Default Re: Why I no longer am happy with my favorite band

    Quote Originally Posted by Vector View Post
    This is another one of those interesting perspectives. This is of course based on opinion/preference, so there is no right or wrong way to see it.

    For me, I think I am on the fence. There is no doubt different versions of the Eagles (original 4 vs +Felder vs -two originals +Walsh and Schmit) created different sounds/songs/fans.
    Still you have to give props to the original 4 as most of the songs on their first Greatest Hits album were just those guys and some with Felder.
    Yet there move toward a more R&R band hit it's pinnacle with the addition of Walsh. Though Schmit came more toward the end of 1977, he added a distinct sound which blended about as well as anyone.

    My guess is that fans of the more country sounding Eagles preferred the original guys the best. Others who were more into rock certainly enjoyed the later incarnation.

    `
    Yeah I certainly dislike folk/bluegrass/country and am all about rock n' roll and so I definitely prefer the Walsh era. It just is better IMO. I'm not a huge fan of the 71-75 album, it's just not my thing. It has some songs I like, but ultimately I'd take Hotel California (the single album) over any other album studio, greatest hits, live, etc they've ever done. I certainly think it's better than the 71-75 collection. There is not one bad song on that album and it's where they really made their group a supergroup with Walsh and really came into huuuge success. They still did softer stuff (ala NKIT) to please some of their early fans, but man for us electric guitar rock n' rollers it was heaven. IMO it started heading in the right direction with Already Gone, then One Of These Nights was pleasing to us with that great electric solo and playing but more into the RnB thing, and then when you get Hotel California you are in classic rock heaven. So many good rockers on HC. HC, LITFL, VOL, etc.

    I think HC covers every kind of song you could want from the band in that one album. It leaves no stone unturned.

    Obviously it's to each his/her own.
    -Austin-
    Resident Guitar Slinger
    Fan of the Eagles from 1972-2016 #NOGLENNNOEAGLES

    RIP Glenn Frey and Randy Meisner

    "So often times it happens that we live our lives in chains and we never even know we have the key..."


  4. #74
    Border Rebel Victim of Love's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Last stop on the Long Road Out of Eden
    Posts
    708

    Default Re: Why I no longer am happy with my favorite band

    Welcome Vector....and to each his own!
    You were just too busy being FABULOUS....

    Victim of Love

  5. #75
    Border Desperado Vector's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Posts
    135

    Default Re: Why I no longer am happy with my favorite band

    Quote Originally Posted by Tori View Post
    My stance on this is that I could not care less about the business side of this band. The Felder thing happened - yeah, it was badly handled and all that, but the past is behind us. As long as these guys keep making music, I'm good. I do have specific feelings about how Frey and Henley handled the situation.... but that's all I'm going to say about that, I think. I could go so much more in depth with this, but I have AP Chemistry homework and honestly, arguing with people on the Internet - even if they have well thought out, respectful opinions and arguements - is a waste of my time.
    AP Chem? Heck we should not see you again until your semester is over.

    I'd like to think we are not arguing, rather having a discussion and exchanging different points of view.
    It is not as if there are posters here who hate the Eagles and want to tell us how great rap is.

  6. #76
    Out on the Border tjrrockandrollmaster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Wareham, MA
    Posts
    71

    Default Re: Why I no longer am happy with my favorite band

    Hey Vector, I know your pain.

    The Eagles' feud luckily was not as bad as (per se) Pink Floyd's was. Roger Waters' power trip makes Don Henley and Glenn Frey look humble by comparison (regardless of Waters having duetted with Henley on Roger's Amused to Death album and Roger returning the favor by doing benefit concerts with Don).

    Glenn reducing his singing worked out for the band as Henley had the better voice (and the voice most associate with the band) intentionally (I can see why, starting with Desperado (the best four man era album IMHO and I wasn't alive when released in 1973 (disadvantage to being born in 1976) but on first listen as a 9 year old in December, 1985 LOVED IT). Now Roger Waters, on the other hand, reduced guitarist/singer/songwriter David Gilmour, drummer/sound effect master Nick Mason and (rest his soul) keyboard player/songwriter Rick Wright to his sidemen starting with Animals (whereas all albums from the More Soundtrack through Wish You Were Here had Gilmour and Wright writing most (if not all) of the music and Waters handled most of the lyrics and what not). Roger rejecting Wright's ideas and much of Gilmour's ideas for Animals (hence why Gilmour and Wright did solo albums in 197 and distanced himself from the band to fly to shows via helicopter whilst the rest of the band either shared or had separate limos. Roger never liked Rick and he wasn't friends with Gilmour really as well (Waters is still somewhat resentful that Gilmour and Mason and Wright carried on as PF without him). First order of business on The Wall was Roger kicked Wright out during the mixing of The Wall but Wright stayed as a salaried musician and did the album and tour (was only member of PF to make money on that tour). During The Wall shows, the band members all had separate trailers as they hated each other.The Final Cut was Roger's way or the highway (Nick Mason's drums are absent and Gilmour's guitar and vocals and contributions were mute and Gilmour and Waters did have a couple fistfights during The Final Cut sessions, I do know luckily The Eagles never had fistfights in the studio though came close on stage).

    Glenn (to his credit) at least didn't pull a Roger Waters and sue his bandmates (Roger sued Gilmour and Mason (whom both brought back Wright into the band after Waters QUIT on his own choice and declared PF "OVER")). I had an opportunity to see The Eagles in 1994 but Pink Floyd won out that year (coincidentally was the final time they toured). I'm considering this tour so I can scratch seeing The Eagles off of my "bucket list" (at least their tickets are cheaper than Mick Jagger and Keith Richards' circus).

    I apologize for bringing the Pink Floyd into the thread (my Autism can manifest itself).
    How I wish, how I wish you were here.

    The three surviving Pink Floyd members (Nick Mason, Roger Waters and David Gilmour) and the Pink Floyd co-founders and key figures who have gone to their rest (Richard "Rick" Wright, "Roger Keith "Syd" Barrett and longtime manager Steve O'Rourke (who managed the band until his 2003 death, God bless them all).

  7. #77
    Border Desperado Vector's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Posts
    135

    Default Re: Why I no longer am happy with my favorite band

    Quote Originally Posted by AstraeaLunaAvani View Post
    Welcome, Vector! Sorry i'm a few days late in replying, I don't get online often.

    I found it quite interesting that this documentary made you like the band less, where it made me like them more! In fact I became obsessed immediately as I watched it, and before this I was only a casual fan who only liked maybe 3 or 4 songs! Interesting how this documentary has affected people differently!
    Thanks for the welcome, and I fully agree it striking people differently. We share the fact we both became more interested in the band, but just in different ways. I expected to watch it, enjoy it, then move on. Instead I found myself baffled at some of the stuff, and some of it not making any sense. So I started on this quest to educate myself and see where it would lead me.

    Music is art, it's creative expression. Which is pretty much the opposite of what a business is. So sad they have to go hand in hand in order for a band to make it big.

    Indeed
    I think that is why so many artists/groups want to find the right manager and leave the business aspect to them. As long as they can trust the guy, why allow all the other junk get into the way of making great music.
    The Eagles seemed to start out with the best of intentions, yet got sucked into the business side because of greed. They did not like the idea of so many different people making money off them, even though much of it was standard practice of the time. So they went and started doing their own publishing, promotion, etc. to make even more money.
    On the one hand there is nothing wrong with that, but it certainly has you thinking and worrying about other things rather than fine tuning your craft.
    When Felder started to wonder why Frey/Henley and Azoff were making more money off these ventures than the other guys, it created friction. According to his book he was told that "those guys are single, so they have more money". Yet Felder thought to himself, how come Azoff can afford to invest so much. He later found out that different aspects of the Eagles business were being steered to Azoff's interests, presumably with Frey and Henley's knowledge.
    At that point ones wonders whether Frey took the same attitude that he and Henley(with the help of Azoff) should make more money, just like he would many years into the future. Now that is purely speculation on my part, but considering Frey's attitude years later, it does not seem like too much of a stretch.

    `

  8. #78
    Border Desperado Vector's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Posts
    135

    Default Re: Why I no longer am happy with my favorite band

    Quote Originally Posted by Houston Debutante View Post
    In my experience, everyone here is free to express their opinions ~ even Felder apologists ~ as long as they do it respectfully. I like that. You'll see some people handle debate better than others though. I'm glad you're not one of those people who gets all affronted and pouty if someone challenges them.
    Why single out Felder apologists vs. apologists of other band members? I ask because I see few to none of the posters names or avatars with Felder, yet a ton of Frey and Henley. There are a few Walsh, Schmit and L-eadon fans, but poor Felder seems like the odd man out.

    Rest assured I will not let a few words ruffle my eagle feathers.


    Quote Originally Posted by Prettymaid View Post
    I'm glad you quoted that part HD. I'm proud of our group for that reason.

    Welcome to The Border, Vector! I hope you'll stick around and join other discussions.
    Thanks for the welcome.

    I am still on my quest to learn with more articles to read via links provided, and the other book I ordered from the library. So I will likely be around for at least a few more weeks. You guys have until then to try and hook me into staying.

  9. #79
    Border Desperado Vector's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Posts
    135

    Default Re: Why I no longer am happy with my favorite band

    Quote Originally Posted by Topkat View Post
    Regarding Don Felder, he said in his interview that he didn't follow politics at that time, & had no idea who Cranston was or what he was about, which is why he made the statement, "I think" that made Glenn so furious with him, which turned into the concert from hell with the two of them about to duke it out right on the stage....In my opinion, Frey over reacted here & took this to a whole new level... Felder said he was not involved in politics, so he was just clueless about this guy.
    You do have to wonder who was making these decisions to do various fund raisers when they could all be taking some much needed time off. I don't care how well you like someone, you need a break from each other now and then. That is especially true of people you work with, even if they are your good friends. So between touring, flying back and forth to the studios, and everything else that demanded their time, political gigs probably should have been avoided.

    As I mentioned, you are likely going to alienate half your fans by publicly pushing your political views. I like Clint Eastwood as an actor and director. Yet I was not really interested in him getting up at the (R) convention and doing his unscripted talk. My guess is his (D) fans enjoyed it even less.

    `

  10. #80
    Out on the Border tjrrockandrollmaster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Wareham, MA
    Posts
    71

    Default Re: Why I no longer am happy with my favorite band

    Quote Originally Posted by Vector View Post
    Thanks for the welcome, and I fully agree it striking people differently. We share the fact we both became more interested in the band, but just in different ways. I expected to watch it, enjoy it, then move on. Instead I found myself baffled at some of the stuff, and some of it not making any sense. So I started on this quest to educate myself and see where it would lead me.

    Music is art, it's creative expression. Which is pretty much the opposite of what a business is. So sad they have to go hand in hand in order for a band to make it big.

    Indeed
    I think that is why so many artists/groups want to find the right manager and leave the business aspect to them. As long as they can trust the guy, why allow all the other junk get into the way of making great music.
    The Eagles seemed to start out with the best of intentions, yet got sucked into the business side because of greed. They did not like the idea of so many different people making money off them, even though much of it was standard practice of the time. So they went and started doing their own publishing, promotion, etc. to make even more money.
    On the one hand there is nothing wrong with that, but it certainly has you thinking and worrying about other things rather than fine tuning your craft.
    When Felder started to wonder why Frey/Henley and Azoff were making more money off these ventures than the other guys, it created friction. According to his book he was told that "those guys are single, so they have more money". Yet Felder thought to himself, how come Azoff can afford to invest so much. He later found out that different aspects of the Eagles business were being steered to Azoff's interests, presumably with Frey and Henley's knowledge.
    At that point ones wonders whether Frey took the same attitude that he and Henley(with the help of Azoff) should make more money, just like he would many years into the future. Now that is purely speculation on my part, but considering Frey's attitude years later, it does not seem like too much of a stretch.

    `
    Not many bands kept managers for long. How The Eagles stayed with Irving Azoff for 40 years is a mystery.

    Peter Grant of Led Zeppelin and Steve O'Rourke who handled Pink Floyd were the managers who changed the name of the game. Grant and O'Rourke negotiated deals that were unheard of (sans Steve Miller who initially made 45 cents per album when he signed to Capitol whilst The Beatles made 12 cents per album. Then Steve eventually went to $1.50 earned per album in latter years with Capitol.

    Zeppelin and Floyd weren't afraid to play hardball. Atlantic never bothered Led Zeppelin and Peter Grant was a promoter and record label's worst nighmare. Watch The Song Remains the Same and you'll see Grant's "TAKE NO PRISONERS TAKE NO S===" disposition. Peter's death was the beginning of the end of the great rock managers who were about to perish.

    Floyd controlled their recordings once Dark Side made them rich beyond the wildest dreams. They formed Pink Floyd Music Ltd which would license albums to CBS/Sony and EMI for distribution from Wish You Were Here forward and also created David Gilmour Music Ltd, Richard Wright Music Overseas Ltd and Nick Mason Ltd for the solo deals (Roger Waters didn't create his until after he left the band) and also Pink Floyd (1987) Ltd. My favorite Steve O'Rourke PF story was when CBS Records called Steve at 2 AM UK time (9 PM EST) whining about the Wish You Were Here sleeve being hidden by blue shrinkwrap to which Steve responded with "F=== OFF". Then the label wanted to give the band smaller royalties for The Wall and Roger Waters won a coin toss which allowed him and the band to keep their normal royalty rate. Another was Steve buying a record exec from CBS a watch reminding him never to be late for a business meeting again. Shame that Steve died so young at 63.

    Only bands I know that own their catalogs are Pink Floyd (who now own their whole catalog and since EMI is no more will probably take catalog to Sony as Warner won't do squat with Floyd), Iron Maiden (same deal and will go Universal or Sony), Queen (same thing when they went to Universal for the world and were with Hollywood (who went from Elektra to PolyGram to Universal over the years)), Genesis (under the individual band members' names and license to Virgin/Universal all over the world sans the US/Canada which is Warner Music), The Rolling Stones (Sticky Fingers onward, been distributed by the big three over the years), AC/DC (went from Warner to Sony and took its catalog with them).
    How I wish, how I wish you were here.

    The three surviving Pink Floyd members (Nick Mason, Roger Waters and David Gilmour) and the Pink Floyd co-founders and key figures who have gone to their rest (Richard "Rick" Wright, "Roger Keith "Syd" Barrett and longtime manager Steve O'Rourke (who managed the band until his 2003 death, God bless them all).

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •