Felder's "Heaven and Hell" Discussion Thread

[jms18222]

My issue with this book is Felder contradicts himself many times. Wanted to talk to Joe over a beer after being fired from the band; a man who can never have a drink again.
He complains that he had to pay to bring a special mattress for Don Henley but then goes into detail about Genn & Don renting an unfurnished red house in the middle of nowhere & slept in sleeping bags in order to be able to write without distraction.
No one forced him to be unfaithful to his wife or use substances. The other guys were single & under no such constraints. If this was such an issue then leave the band like Bernie & Randy did otherwise stop with this resentment.
Bottom line is without Frey & Henley the Eagles would have remained i the 1970's. There wasn't an Eagles group without BOTH those guys. The Eagles have continued & have been successful without Don Felder.
I used to really like Felder but after reading his book, he really annoyed me with his constant references to "The Gods". Should have given it a rest after a chapter or 2.
Just my 2 cents.

[UndertheWire]

I took "talking over a beer" as just an inappropriate figure of speech.

[chaim]

I have always felt reading this discussion and other posts about Don Felder that he is not given the praise he deserves. He proved on the albums he played on that he contributes quite a bit to the band, gives it a unique sound with his guitar playing. I don't believe in my opinion it's fair to say any one player is more important than another.

IMO Don sometimes gives himself TOO much credit. Does now and did when he had just joined. For example, like I've complained before, in the book he says that Randy and Bernie were just as responsible for the first GH album becoming such a hit as Glenn, Don H and himself. IMO that's a plain lie. He strums an acoustic (if even that) on one song (Lyin' Eyes), plays a bit of lead with Glenn on one (Already Gone) and very much helped arrange one song and played lead on it (OOTN). Maybe he played a bit of electric on TITTL, but it's barely audible. Randy and Bernie play (and perhaps sing) on all the songs. IMO it's not fair from Don to place himself on the same level as Randy and Bernie there.

[AlreadyGone95]

Imo, I think that Don F has done little work or alot less work than the other 6 guys that have been in the band. Our guys might not have the best track record when it comes to releasing new music, but overall, as individuals, Felder has done the least amount of work both with and without the Eagles. I think he realizes this, so he tries to make his work with the Eagles seem like it made the Eagles. His biggest contribution is no doubt the starting of Hotel California, but he did the music. Either Don H or the Henley/Frey duo wrote the lyrics. For a guy with an amount of guitar playing skill as "Fingers" Felder, he doesn't seem to enjoy showing his fans new material showcasing that talent. You've been free from "The Gods" from over 14 years now, and all you've managed is a book and one album? (I admit I've not heard either Airborne or Road to Forever yet)

I'm probably repeating what others have said before, though. I read through this thread once, but I can't remember exactly what all was discussed.

[AlreadyGone95]

One other thing. If I was subject to as much abuse as Felder says he was, I'd be happy to get off that rollercoaster! Why would you willingly subject yourself to stuff like that?

[UndertheWire]

There's so little information on their creative process, that it's hard to tell how much Don Felder contributed beyond playing guitar. They became more successful after he joined and their sound changed but that was a group effort (including Bill Szymczyk) and we can't tell how much of the impetus came from Don. The band had made a decision to push for a harder sound, chose a new producer and recruited Don to help them achieve that move. And then came Joe.

I've heard/read praise from Glenn and Bill, but I can't remember anyone else. Joe? Henley?

Felder has writing credits on 6 Eagles songs. My guess is that he also played a big part in the arrangement of those songs. To me, "Those Shoes", "Victim of Love" and "Visions" sound similar enough to his work on Airborne, to support this whereas the "Memphis R&B" tracks seem more likely to be Glenn's arrangements (maybe with help from Bill who was also a big R&B fan).

On this board, we may be too hard on Don partly as a reaction to the people on youtube and such who give him too much credit for the band's success.

[WalshFan88]

I disagree on the statement that he's done less than the other guys. Leaving DH and GF out of it for the time being, he's contributed as much to the band as Joe, Tim, Randy, and Bernie has.

[AlreadyGone95]

On this board, we may be too hard on Don partly as a reaction to the people on youtube and such who give him too much credit for the band's success.

I actually kind of agree with this. It seems that most casual fans who read his book think that Felder himself contributed most to the band that he was an original member.

[UndertheWire]

I disagree on the statement that he's done less than the other guys. Leaving DH and GF out of it for the time being, he's contributed as much to the band as Joe, Tim, Randy, and Bernie has.

I read it as AG was talking about their entire catalog, not just that with the Eagles. So Tim has Poco has lots of work with Poco as well as his solo recordings, Joe has James Gang, Barnstorm and his solo records etc. Don has Flow and two solo records. He's also a bit short on session credits compared with the others, although he must have done a lot of uncredited work in his early days.

[AlreadyGone95]

I disagree on the statement that he's done less than the other guys. Leaving DH and GF out of it for the time being, he's contributed as much to the band as Joe, Tim, Randy, and Bernie has.

I was thinking along the lines of how many of their albums he played on (both studio and live), his musical contributions, and his singing contributions.

*if I've got any info wrong, I apologize.
Albums:

Bernie- played, sang, and wrote (or co-wrote) on the 4 albums he appears on, plus GH.
Randy- same as Bernie, except he did 5 albums, and both GH albums
Joe- 3 studio albums, Eagles Live, HFO, F1 (ok I don't know if F1 counts, but since One Day at a Time is on there...)
Tim- 2 studio albums, Eagles live, HFO, F1
Don F- 3 studio albums(4 if you count OTB), Eagles Live, HFO.

Singing: (studio tracks only)
Bernie- 6 leads
Randy- 8 leads, 1 co-lead
Joe- 4 leads
Tim- 4 leads
Don Felder only sang one song during his tenure- Visions.

Writing: (studio tracks only)
Bernie- 4 by himself, 5 co-writes
Randy- 3 by himself, 4 co-writes
Joe- 2 by himself, 2 co-writes
Timothy- 3 co- writes.
As UTW said, Felder has 6 co writes.

I can see Don F and Joe and Timothy being put in the same group, but Bernie and Randy contributed more while they were in the band