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Thread: Felder's "Heaven and Hell" Discussion Thread

  1. #1131
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    Default Re: Felder's "Heaven and Hell" Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by redstorm1968 View Post
    Opinions are like belly buttons, everyone has one. I enjoyed the book, I like Felder and I don't feel like I have to take sides in order to be a fan of Frey and Henley's. I am an Eagles fan before I am a fan of any one individual.
    You've summed up my thoughts exactly!! As a lifelong Henley fan, i went into reading the book with preconceived notions about Felder, but...let's just say my rose-colored glasses got knocked off. NONE of them are straight out angels or demons. None of us were there, so we don't know what really went on, or what the band's internal dynamics are/were. It was nice to hear another side of the story for a change.

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    Default Re: Felder's "Heaven and Hell" Discussion Thread

    I've just read the "change a word and gain a third" quote repeated elsewhere and it's something that has me puzzled. It appears in the book, attributed to Bernie and Randy but I haven't heard either of them say anything about it in interviews. It's something that gets repeated frequently.

    The book quote, which is in the section about working on the One of These Nights album:
    Bernie, meanwhile, became increasingly dissatisfied with how the pair of them treated him and Randy. He didn’t like them taking rough mixes back to their house to decide what tracks would stay or go, nor did he and Randy like what they described as Glenn’s ability to “change a word and gain a third”—coming to a song that was in their minds substantially done, with lyrics and music, making what to them seemed to be modest contributions, and suddenly becoming entitled to a third of the songwriting royalties.
    However, in Cameron Crowe's 1975 Rolling Stone article, Henley says:
    We've just taken it upon ourselves that this is our department. Maybe we're full of shit but I think we've proven ourselves. We recognize the fact that those guys have got a need to say something and if we can help them say it better, then I think everybody's better off. It's not a matter of credit or money or any of that stuff. We've been splitting the publishing equally from the beginning.
    In the documentary, Bernie talks about "band publishing" and indeed there is a common publishing company, Kicking Bear, credited on the first three albums and "Their Greatest Hits 1971-1975. This seems to back up Don Henley's statement of how publishing royalties were handled prior to Hotel California.

    So rather than "change a word to gain a third", it seems that during Bernie's time in the band, each of the band members would have benefited equally financially regardless of who received a credit and that Felder's reporting is misleading.

  3. #1133
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    Default Re: Felder's "Heaven and Hell" Discussion Thread

    I would understand if it was just a credit thing - that Randy and/or Bernie complained how Glenn got his name in there after not doing that much. But when Felder mentions "royalties", it's different.

  4. #1134
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    Default Re: Felder's "Heaven and Hell" Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by UndertheWire View Post
    So rather than "change a word to gain a third", it seems that during Bernie's time in the band, each of the band members would have benefited equally financially regardless of who received a credit and that Felder's reporting is misleading.
    Publishing is typically only 50% of the pie. The songwriter(s) get(s) the other half.

  5. #1135
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    Default Re: Felder's "Heaven and Hell" Discussion Thread

    Oh my. I thought publishing royalties were the same as songwriting royalties.

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    Default Re: Felder's "Heaven and Hell" Discussion Thread

    I'm going to have another go at this.

    Scarlet Sun, could you explain how it works?

    I understand that songwriters would typically sign over 50% of their songwriter royalty to a publishing company such as Warner Chapell in return for that company collecting the royalties and trying to sell the song to other performers.

    I assumed that when Bernie and Don H referred to "publishing", they were talking about the songwriter's share and in this case, they had signed an agreement giving David Geffen a 50% share, but that the remaining 50% was shared equally by the band members.
    Last edited by UndertheWire; 09-28-2016 at 02:19 PM.

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    Default Re: Felder's "Heaven and Hell" Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by UndertheWire View Post
    Can you explain how this works? I think I've misunderstood how it works - I assumed "publishing" and the "songwriting" share were the same.

    In the case of the early Eagles, does this mean that of the 100% royalties

    - songwriters would receive 50%
    - 25% (50% of 50%) would go to the publisher (eg Warner Chapell)
    - 12.5% (50% of 50% of 50%) would go to Geffen
    - 3.125% (25% of 50% of 50% of 50%) to each of the band members?
    According to Eliot:

    - songwriters would receive 50%
    - 25% would go to Kicking Bear (6.25% for each of the original four Eagles)
    - 25% would go to Benchmark (Geffen's publishing entity)

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    Default Re: Felder's "Heaven and Hell" Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Scarlet Sun View Post
    According to Eliot:

    - songwriters would receive 50%
    - 25% would go to Kicking Bear (6.25% for each of the original four Eagles)
    - 25% would go to Benchmark (Geffen's publishing entity)
    If that's the case, then Glenn would have received a quarter regardless of whether he changed a word, wrote the entire song or did nothing. And once Felder joined, that would go down to a fifth for new songs.

  9. #1139
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    Default Re: Felder's "Heaven and Hell" Discussion Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by UndertheWire View Post
    If that's the case, then Glenn would have received a quarter regardless of whether he changed a word, wrote the entire song or did nothing. And once Felder joined, that would go down to a fifth for new songs.
    No, "change a word to gain a third" would mean 33% of the 50% songwriters' share or an additional 16.7% overall
    Last edited by Scarlet Sun; 09-28-2016 at 04:35 PM. Reason: additional content

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    Default Re: Felder's "Heaven and Hell" Discussion Thread

    I'm just thinking, how different life would have been for Felder, if he had to write the words to Hotel California himself. I'm guessing that there isn't much, in Heaven And Hell, about his education.

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