Felder's "Heaven and Hell" Discussion Thread

[Freypower]

We had an entire topic on this.

https://www.eaglesonlinecentral.com/...ead.php?t=3729

My opinion of Felder's deliberate misrepresentation of events here is well known.

[Turf]

We had an entire topic on this.

https://www.eaglesonlinecentral.com/...ead.php?t=3729

My opinion of Felder's deliberate misrepresentation of events here is well known.

I went back and read that thread, read the thread that it referenced, and waited through a minute long birth-control advertisement so I could hear Glenn play the solo live - all well and good (well, I coulda done without the advertisement...).

But I'm not finding Felder's deliberate misrepresentation here. I see some fans were confused about who played on the recording which, IMO, is perfectly understandable given the circumstances surrounding the solo.

Maybe I'm missing something, but I don't get it...

[Turf]

I like this book in many ways, and I find myself re-reading it once in a while. I notice some hilariously written bits here and there, like this piece of brilliantly constructed storytelling my eyes caught today:

Don talks about the band rehearsing "I can't tell you why" for the first time:

"This is a killer track, Timmy", I told him, "I'm gonna have some fun working out my guitar parts for this."

Right after this comes: "Don and Glenn seemed burned out".

In other words, Timothy came up with a killer song and Don F helped Timothy with it, while Don and Glenn were being "burned out".
Has Don forgotten that Glenn came up with the intro, the "try to keep your head little girl" counter melody, and all the lead guitar parts for that song?

He really didn't go into too much detail about the recording of the song. We know he did play on the song and he didn't contribute enough (if at all) to earn writing credits. I personally don't see these statements as especially misrepresentative based on the limited knowledge that we have about the events.

Anyway, just my opinion...

[Freypower]

He says to Tim that he is looking forward to working out his guitar parts implying that he will be playing the solos. If the 'circumstances surrounding the solo' you refer in your previous post concern the video, all the confused people had to do was read the album credits.

[Turf]

He says to Tim that he is looking forward to working out his guitar parts implying that he will be playing the solos. If the 'circumstances surrounding the solo' you refer in your previous post concern the video, all the confused people had to do was read the album credits.

Yes, he's including a sentence in his book which he specifically recalls, presumably. Do you think he's really caught up in this confusion/debate about whether or not he wrote/played the solo on ICTYW? I sincerely doubt it. I also doubt he's going to say to himself: "I'd like to include that sentence, but if I do I'm afraid people will infer that I wrote the solo to the song." And as you say, the credits are published. I'm sure he knows what the credits say. I suspect he considers it a nonissue.

Additionally, he may well have added something to the way in which his guitar part was played. Walsh probably would have added something if he played guitar. They were all very experienced musicians. It's hard for me to imagine one band member saying "play this chord, that chord, this other chord exactly like this." Of course, whatever he may have done wasn't sufficient to warrant writing credits - understood...

The other thing is that the above referenced thread had a quote where Glenn was saying both Felder and Walsh tried to come up with something for the solo, but ultimately Glenn's was the best.

Regarding the "circumstances," I meant that (a) Felder always played it live when he was in the band and (b) the video showed him playing it. I appreciate the point that people were making about the video not being the actual recording. But, one should also keep in mind that the point of these "recording studio" videos is really to create the illusion that the song is being recorded. It's true that all one had to do was look at the credits, but the fact of the matter is that relatively few people are going to check the credits and if people don't, it's easy to understand how they may believe Felder played on the recording.

[ThePerfectBeast]

I have held off reading this book as I got the impression it would be over-sensationalised or exaggerated.I've read "To the Limit" (admittidley some time ago) and thought some of the stuff had to be taken with a pinch of salt.

One question , is it worth a read? Is it a relatively fair account of things as much as anyone can tell?

[chaim]

Yes, he's including a sentence in his book which he specifically recalls, presumably. Do you think he's really caught up in this confusion/debate about whether or not he wrote/played the solo on ICTYW? I sincerely doubt it. I also doubt he's going to say to himself: "I'd like to include that sentence, but if I do I'm afraid people will infer that I wrote the solo to the song." And as you say, the credits are published. I'm sure he knows what the credits say. I suspect he considers it a nonissue.

Additionally, he may well have added something to the way in which his guitar part was played. Walsh probably would have added something if he played guitar. They were all very experienced musicians. It's hard for me to imagine one band member saying "play this chord, that chord, this other chord exactly like this." Of course, whatever he may have done wasn't sufficient to warrant writing credits - understood...

The other thing is that the above referenced thread had a quote where Glenn was saying both Felder and Walsh tried to come up with something for the solo, but ultimately Glenn's was the best.

Regarding the "circumstances," I meant that (a) Felder always played it live when he was in the band and (b) the video showed him playing it. I appreciate the point that people were making about the video not being the actual recording. But, one should also keep in mind that the point of these "recording studio" videos is really to create the illusion that the song is being recorded. It's true that all one had to do was look at the credits, but the fact of the matter is that relatively few people are going to check the credits and if people don't, it's easy to understand how they may believe Felder played on the recording.

That last post of mine wasn't meant to be about the ICTYW solo, but about the funny way in which those pieces of text are edited together in the book. Right after Don speaks about his "real sensual guitar", he offers that Don H and Glenn seemed burned out. I just thought that it's hilarious, because Glenn and Don did contribute to that same song, more than Don Fin fact. Don F came up with that brilliant rhythm guitar part, and I certainly didn't mean to minimize his contribution.

I didn't remember that other thread, although I started it! Anyway, there are people on YouTube saying that it's Don F's solo and when someone tried to tell them that it was written and originally played by Glenn, he was ridiculed. But like you or someone else said, maybe Don is not aware that people think it's him even on the record, because of the credits. On the other hand, I've seen people who are aware of the credits, suggest that it was an error.

[TimothyBFan]

I started reading this part of the thread simply because it had to do with ICTYW and pretty obvious why that caught my attention. But I found a few things interesting that are being discussed.

This was THE FIRST TIME they rehearsed it.

Don talks about the band rehearsing "I can't tell you why" for the first time:

"This is a killer track, Timmy", I told him, "I'm gonna have some fun working out my guitar parts for this."

The other thing is that the above referenced thread had a quote where Glenn was saying both Felder and Walsh tried to come up with something for the solo, but ultimately Glenn's was the best.

To me it sounds as if Don and Joe both TRIED to come up with the solo but that Glenn's idea was the best so therefore they used it.

Why then is there dispute/argument/discussion about Don making that statement early on? If what Glenn says is true, he did indeed try to work out the guitar parts.

He says to Tim that he is looking forward to working out his guitar parts implying that he will be playing the solos.

I don't see that as he was necessarily talking about the solo parts. There's a lot more to guitar parts in songs than just the solos, especially when you have as many gifted guitar players in a band as the Eagles do. Right?

[Topkat]

I have held off reading this book as I got the impression it would be over-sensationalised or exaggerated.I've read "To the Limit" (admittidley some time ago) and thought some of the stuff had to be taken with a pinch of salt.

One question , is it worth a read? Is it a relatively fair account of things as much as anyone can tell?

I read the book about 2 years ago, & I enjoyed it, but it can be a little hard at times...I think that this is Don Felder's story, & the others will probably say different things about different situations that are written about...You have to keep in mind that they were all doing tons of drugs, so maybe some of these memories are a bit distorted or unclear almost 40 years later.

My impression was that it was a good read. I didn't know much about the guy before reading it, so I wanted to find out more. It also shows me that things between the Eagles were not as harmonious off the stage as it was on the stage...I liked the book, but take it like everything else, with a grain of salt. My feeling is that at least it was written by a band member, not an outsider.

[ThePerfectBeast]

I read the book about 2 years ago, & I enjoyed it, but it can be a little hard at times...I think that this is Don Felder's story, & the others will probably say different things about different situations that are written about...You have to keep in mind that they were all doing tons of drugs, so maybe some of these memories are a bit distorted or unclear almost 40 years later.

My impression was that it was a good read. I didn't know much about the guy before reading it, so I wanted to find out more. It also shows me that things between the Eagles were not as harmonious off the stage as it was on the stage...I liked the book, but take it like everything else, with a grain of salt. My feeling is that at least it was written by a band member, not an outsider.

Thanks for the reply Topkat , sounds like it's worth checking out.