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Thread: For Those Saying Glenn Frey is Necessary to the Eagles; no Glenn, no legit Eagles

  1. #1011
    Moderator Ive always been a dreamer's Avatar
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    Default Re: For Those Saying Glenn Frey is Necessary to the Eagles; no Glenn, no legit Eagles

    Needless to say, I agree with what every one of you have said regarding the comments in this review.

    Of course, I believe the practice of just casually substituting other artists in place of a music legend is disrespectful to that artist's body of work. I wholeheartedly agree with what FP wrote here ...

    Quote Originally Posted by Freypower
    The viewpoint is insulting because it basically says that anybody can sing or play these songs - vocal quality & musicianship isn't important. Just play the notes in the right order & sing in tune, and the fans won't care.
    Unfortunately, I think the reviewer is correct that this is becoming the mindset of many fans. And he is making exactly the same point that I was making earlier in this thread that some members scoffed at - if the trend continues, it is not at all inconceivable that at some point in the future, the 'Eagles' will still be performing with a next generation of performers. To me, the mere thought of this is beyond sad.

    "People don't run out of dreams: People just run out of time ..."
    Glenn Frey 11/06/1948 - 01/18/2016

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    Default Re: For Those Saying Glenn Frey is Necessary to the Eagles; no Glenn, no legit Eagles

    When rock music first started, it was mainly individuals with backing bands; people like BIll Haley, Buddy Holly, or people who billed themselves as solo artists like Chuck Berry & Elvis Presley. The era of bands composing & playing their own music really (In my view) started with the Beatles. People wanted to be in bands, to be part of the era of self-expression. They were no longer prepared to play songs written by others (although this lived on in the Motown vocal groups).

    For a time in the mid 60s you had the bubblegum sound, which was prepackaged music performed by anonymous, interchangeable musicians who never even played live. At one stage this even descended to the level of a cartoon (the Archies).

    Now what is being said is as the classic rock era comes to an end as more & more of its most famous musicians die, there wil be something called 'franchising' or 'branding' where musicians use a famous band name to play that band's music even if they have a barely tenuous connection to the actual band.

    Mark Knopfler wrote a song about this called Terminal Of Tribute To. It would be harsh to quote it, because some would say the 'Eagles' haven't been reduced to this yet. But as Dreamer says above, it could happen.

    https://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/mark...tributeto.html

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    Administrator sodascouts's Avatar
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    Default Re: For Those Saying Glenn Frey is Necessary to the Eagles; no Glenn, no legit Eagles

    Quote Originally Posted by Freypower View Post
    Mark Knopfler wrote a song about this called Terminal Of Tribute To. It would be harsh to quote it, because some would say the 'Eagles' haven't been reduced to this yet. But as Dreamer says above, it could happen.

    https://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/mark...tributeto.html

    Yeah - they still have one original member.

    Always in our hearts, Never forgotten

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    Default Re: For Those Saying Glenn Frey is Necessary to the Eagles; no Glenn, no legit Eagles

    Here are some interesting comments by Devon Allman about 'bloodliine' bands.

    http://ultimateclassicrock.com/devon...oodline-bands/

    “There’s tribute bands out the ass,” Allman told Rolling Stone in a new interview. “It’s a big, money-making deal. But wouldn’t you rather see a Bonham beat the shit out of the drums? And wouldn’t you rather hear an Allman and a Betts do ‘Blue Sky’ and ‘Midnight Rider’ instead of a tribute band? Hell, yes, you would!”

    Well, yes. I just did see Jason Bonham. But as I said above, it was not remotely near the experience of seeing Led Zeppelin. I have seen Dweezil Zappa three times. They were worth seeing but it is not the same, and it is not necessarily better than a tribute band because of one musician's surname. Not all siblings of musicians have the same amount of talent as their fathers. It just doesn't work that way.

    So people seeing what now passes for the Eagles think it's good enough because Glenn Frey's son is an adequate substitute and hey, the others are still there, so what's the big deal?

    I am now going to quote from T.S. Eliot's The Love Song of J. Alfred Prufrock, one of my favourite poems. If some object to the last line I'm afraid that cannot be helped. I have been waiting for a chance to post this for some time. Think of it as a final way of getting this out of my system.

    No! I am not Prince Hamlet, nor was meant to be;
    Am an attendant lord, one that will do
    To swell a progress, start a scene or two,
    Advise the prince; no doubt, an easy tool,
    Deferential, glad to be of use,
    Politic, cautious, and meticulous;
    Full of high sentence, but a bit obtuse;
    At times, indeed, almost ridiculous—
    Almost, at times, the Fool.

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    Default Re: For Those Saying Glenn Frey is Necessary to the Eagles; no Glenn, no legit Eagles

    Quote Originally Posted by Freypower View Post
    Here are some interesting comments by Devon Allman about 'bloodliine' bands.

    http://ultimateclassicrock.com/devon...oodline-bands/

    “There’s tribute bands out the ass,” Allman told Rolling Stone in a new interview. “It’s a big, money-making deal. But wouldn’t you rather see a Bonham beat the shit out of the drums? And wouldn’t you rather hear an Allman and a Betts do ‘Blue Sky’ and ‘Midnight Rider’ instead of a tribute band? Hell, yes, you would!”

    Well, yes. I just did see Jason Bonham. But as I said above, it was not remotely near the experience of seeing Led Zeppelin. I have seen Dweezil Zappa three times. They were worth seeing but it is not the same, and it is not necessarily better than a tribute band because of one musician's surname. Not all siblings of musicians have the same amount of talent as their fathers. It just doesn't work that way.

    So people seeing what now passes for the Eagles think it's good enough because Glenn Frey's son is an adequate substitute and hey, the others are still there, so what's the big deal?

    I am now going to quote from T.S. Eliot's The Love Song of J. Alfred Prufrock, one of my favourite poems. If some object to the last line I'm afraid that cannot be helped. I have been waiting for a chance to post this for some time. Think of it as a final way of getting this out of my system.

    No! I am not Prince Hamlet, nor was meant to be;
    Am an attendant lord, one that will do
    To swell a progress, start a scene or two,
    Advise the prince; no doubt, an easy tool,
    Deferential, glad to be of use,
    Politic, cautious, and meticulous;
    Full of high sentence, but a bit obtuse;
    At times, indeed, almost ridiculous—
    Almost, at times, the Fool.
    Lovely poem. Spot on too.


    "Let's burn our long johns and head west" - Glenn Frey 1948-2016

  6. #1016
    Administrator sodascouts's Avatar
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    Default Re: For Those Saying Glenn Frey is Necessary to the Eagles; no Glenn, no legit Eagles

    Quote Originally Posted by Freypower View Post
    Here are some interesting comments by Devon Allman about 'bloodliine' bands.

    http://ultimateclassicrock.com/devon...oodline-bands/

    “There’s tribute bands out the ass,” Allman told Rolling Stone in a new interview. “It’s a big, money-making deal. But wouldn’t you rather see a Bonham beat the shit out of the drums? And wouldn’t you rather hear an Allman and a Betts do ‘Blue Sky’ and ‘Midnight Rider’ instead of a tribute band? Hell, yes, you would!”

    Well, yes. I just did see Jason Bonham. But as I said above, it was not remotely near the experience of seeing Led Zeppelin. I have seen Dweezil Zappa three times. They were worth seeing but it is not the same, and it is not necessarily better than a tribute band because of one musician's surname. Not all siblings of musicians have the same amount of talent as their fathers. It just doesn't work that way.

    So people seeing what now passes for the Eagles think it's good enough because Glenn Frey's son is an adequate substitute and hey, the others are still there, so what's the big deal?

    I am now going to quote from T.S. Eliot's The Love Song of J. Alfred Prufrock, one of my favourite poems. If some object to the last line I'm afraid that cannot be helped. I have been waiting for a chance to post this for some time. Think of it as a final way of getting this out of my system.

    No! I am not Prince Hamlet, nor was meant to be;
    Am an attendant lord, one that will do
    To swell a progress, start a scene or two,
    Advise the prince; no doubt, an easy tool,
    Deferential, glad to be of use,
    Politic, cautious, and meticulous;
    Full of high sentence, but a bit obtuse;
    At times, indeed, almost ridiculous—
    Almost, at times, the Fool.

    This idea of passing down your position in your band to a relative like it was a piece of furniture is ludicrous and in the past, unheard of...

    Even if you wanted to follow in your father's footsteps as a musician, you still started your own band. You'd honor him not by spending years playing his music, but by using him as an inspiration for your own.

    That doesn't allow anyone to capitalize on a brand name, though. So instead we have our legacy acts shoving their children into their vacated roles, as if they were interchangeable and their kids had no separate identity, skill set, or purpose in life.

    FP - nice use of Eliot.

    Always in our hearts, Never forgotten

  7. #1017
    Stuck on the Border Dawn's Avatar
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    Default Re: For Those Saying Glenn Frey is Necessary to the Eagles; no Glenn, no legit Eagles

    Quote Originally Posted by sodascouts View Post
    This idea of passing down your position in your band to a relative like it was a piece of furniture is ludicrous and in the past, unheard of...

    Even if you wanted to follow in your father's footsteps as a musician, you still started your own band. You'd honor him not spending years playing his music, but by using him as an inspiration for your own.

    That doesn't allow anyone to capitalize on a brand name, though. So instead we have our legacy acts shoving their children into their vacated roles, as if they were interchangeable and their kids had no separate identity, skill set, or purpose in life.

    FP - nice use of Eliot.
    Wow, I am nearly speechless. Thank you Soda. Painful as it is ... IMHO this is exactly what has happened.

    To add further insult to injury -- Vince Gill hitching his wagon to the Eagles brand.
    Last edited by Dawn; 06-21-2018 at 12:08 PM.


    "Let's burn our long johns and head west" - Glenn Frey 1948-2016

  8. #1018
    Administrator sodascouts's Avatar
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    Default Re: For Those Saying Glenn Frey is Necessary to the Eagles; no Glenn, no legit Eagles

    Quote Originally Posted by Dawn View Post
    Wow, I am nearly speechless. Thank you Soda. Painful as it is ... IMHO this is exactly what has happened.
    Thanks. I know some might think I sound harsh. However, in the case of the "Eagles", I don't blame Deacon, a kid presented with stacks of money and fame on a platter, told it's a way of honoring his father to boot. I blame those who are manipulating him.

    To add further insult to injury -- Vince Gill hitching his wagon to the Eagles brand.
    He should've said no... but again, his dream of becoming an Eagle was dangled in front of him and why should be be loyal to Glenn? They weren't really friends.

    Yeah, they may have played golf together a couple times and Glenn was friendly (of course), as he was eager to point out, but how far does that go? Yeah, he was a big fan of the Eagles, but was he a big fan of Glenn's solo work? Did he feel a real connection with the man in any other way but "lead singer and guitarist for the Eagles, nice guy I met a couple times?" Fat chance, my friends, or he would have said so.

    That weak link is not going to make him turn down millions of dollars and living his dream. As for turning it down on principle? Well, I'm sure Don told him "I really think this is what Glenn would have wanted. He would just LOVE that you're replacing him... I mean... that you're keeping his songs from dying, as they surely would be forgotten unless we tour constantly!"

    The real blame likes with the one who asked him.

    Always in our hearts, Never forgotten

  9. #1019
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    Default Re: For Those Saying Glenn Frey is Necessary to the Eagles; no Glenn, no legit Eagles

    Soda, those are a couple of brilliant posts & I totally agree with them.

    Another analogy that could be made is with the theatre or film.

    If you are the son or daughter of an actor & wish to become an actor, you want to play the roles which suit you, not your parent's roles (unless you are Brandon Lee, Bruce Lee's son, I guess). You want to carve your own path.

    When you go to the theatre you're seeing a performance of a play, and 'the play's the thing'. The play is more important than the actors, although if roles are miscast, obviously problems occur. Plays may once have been written for specific people to play (Richard Burbage in Shakespeare) but as times change, so do the actors and for that matter so does the style of performance.

    Rock music however, real rock music, was supposed to be about specific groups of musicians, who wrote & recorded their songs. Audiences went to see THOSE PARTICULAR MUSICIANS, not substitutes & certainly not family members. It was a much more individualistic system than the theatre because it was based on personal work. What the 'Eagles' and 'Fleetwood Mac' and this whole 'bloodlines' stuff are attempting to tell us is that the songs are more important than the original individuals who created them.

    Anyway this is probably repeating the same thing too often now.
    Last edited by Freypower; 06-21-2018 at 08:27 PM.

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    Default Re: For Those Saying Glenn Frey is Necessary to the Eagles; no Glenn, no legit Eagles

    And that's really the divide isn't it. People who feel like the songs and experience are more important, and people who think the person singing them is more important.

    I will say that in some forms of music, the song is more important. In Southern Gospel music, specifically in the male quartet world, the members of groups change ALOT, and it is all about the sound, and the song.
    One group that I really enjoy are the Kingsmen quartet. They have probably had 100 members over the 50 or so years the group has been around.
    I think precedent is an issue too though. Those groups were changing from the beginning, through the entire life of the group. And they typically don't write their own songs.
    And another issue that we don't see with groups like the Eagles, is that these gospel groups setlists change almost entirely over time. The Kingsmen probably only play a couple of songs that are over 10 or 15 years old. They don't do 3 hour marathon performances of all the "hits" because they have many many hits, and release many albums. They have done 12 albums since 2000.
    I think like Freypower said, Rock music is very different and very unique in the way the song is associated with the person.

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