Song power or what?

[UndertheWire]

This came up in the underrated song survivor but I wanted more!



The Eagles say their longevity is down to song power but having witnessed many great songs murdered by awful performances I think a large chunk of the credit should be given to the band's enduring musical talent.


You have hit the nail on the head, F50! Obviously, great songs are needed, but it's only part of the reason they are selling out venues. They know how to put on a high quality show and still make it about the songs.

When asked the secret of their success, Glenn gives a long list of song titles. Tim is more succinct: "It's the songs." Are they right? How much is the song and how much is the arrangement, the performance or something else?

How often are Eagles songs covered by other artists and how successful have they been? Exclude Eagles tribute bands and the Common Thread recordings where it's more about the Eagles than the song.

I often see people dismissing the Henley/Frey writing partnership by pointing out how many Eagles songs were written with or by other people, and yet those songs sound just as, if not more, Eaglely (Eaglish?). What gives them that sound?

And then there are the Eagles songs that don't really sound like the Eagles. Someone pointed out The Disco Strangler which doesn't have the characteristic harmony singing or much in the way of music.

I'm sorry, I don't have much to offer other than questions .

[VAisForEagleLovers]

Good topic, UTW! I think that when they say their enduring success is due to the songs, they are including the arrangements in that statement. Perhaps not, but Glenn's comments during interviews for After Hours, when he was talking about other people's songs, he said there was a reason they were sung the way they were by the original artists, right down to the key it was in. So that tells me that when he thinks of a song, he thinks of the entire thing including the arrangement.

As for the songs themselves, to be successful over the long haul, you need a few great songs and a lot of good songs. I don't think it matters how great an arrangement is, how fantastic the harmonies, how mind blowing the guitar riffs are if the songs are mediocre. That formula will get you a couple great tours and a couple high selling albums.

We can't say that Jackson Brown 'covers' TIE, but he said recently in an interview that when he plays it in his acoustic set, people sing along, and they're singing the Eagles' version instead of what he's singing.

We know Linda Ronstadt sang Desperado. Diana Krall recently released a version of it as well. Michael Buble did Heartache Tonight. Over the years, to hear songs on mainstream radio, I really don't remember others.

[UndertheWire]

Also, it's not about the lead singer - the Eagles have had hits with four different leads - and yet they're all Eagles songs. There are other bands whose identity is closely tied with the lead singer possibly because he's also the main songwriter (eg Bread/David Gates, Police/Sting).

[VAisForEagleLovers]

There are so many aspects to their success, it's no wonder they've gone as long as they have. I've given this some thought since my last post... Please forgive the verbosity.

1...the songs. Songs people can relate to. Songs about life sung in fun ways. Even the songs they sing they didn't write, they were smart enough to pick the ones that people could identify with. Look at Already Gone, who hasn't been in that position?

2...the voices. The line up has changed over the years, the original four could all sing and sing well. Two of them left and the two that replaced them could sing and sing well, and in ways that fit in with the existing band. The two that have been in the band throughout and do most of the leads have voices that perfectly complement each other. Back before a shuffle option on thousands of albums at a time was an option, you put a vinyl album on a record player and listened to another side before the next album dropped down. Having so many who could sing leads meant you didn't get the same-old-same-old even on the filler songs.

3...the harmonies. If you've got it, flaunt it. They wrote songs that played to their strengths. Our guys were always ambitious and driven to succeed, which meant they did a lot of what they did best.

4...the arrangements. Besides the harmonies (which is part of the arrangements), they sang their songs in ways that made it easy to sing along with (even the guitar parts). There are a lot of people in this day and age that criticize them as being too 'pop'. They didn't write and sing 'pop'. They wrote and sang what they wanted and it was so freaking great it defined what was popular.

5...the performances. They did and still do perform their songs at the highest of levels. They know what the fans want, and they give it to them. Even songs that have been rearranged. In the HOTE tour, when Glenn mentions rearranging a song to be like the Beach Boys, I've often heard groans around me, because no one wants a rearranged song. Then they play it and those same people are up dancing, clapping, and smiling from ear to ear. They call it 'rearranged', but it's still the same song and still something everyone can sing along to, and it always works.

6...the work. While our guys want to be paid and paid well for performing, they believe very strongly in earning what they make. Even back when the songs were being written and originally recorded, while they partied a lot, they put the work first. They still have a very strong work ethic that a lot of us could learn from in whatever jobs we have.

The reason it comes down to Song Power is because without #1 above, it doesn't really matter how well you do #2 through #6. Like I said, you can do it without great songs, but not for 43 years.

[MaryCalifornia]

Yeah, I think when the guys say "it's the songs" they're attempting to be modest. Timothy's not going to say, "It's because we're all extremely accomplished musicians and vocalists who adhere to an old timey work ethic of much rehearsing and clean living, and we've managed to stay in good health all these years, and we are still up for the grind of world tours, etc..etc..." Neither is Glenn, Don or Joe going to say that. Of course it's the songs, but many other acts would not still be playing them to the level that our guys do, and the songs have survived the decades and still sound good.

[Diana Krall just released ICTYW, too!]

[Brooke]

VA, very good analogy! :thumbsup:

I think it's the songs WITH those voices that make those songs everlasting, that make them magic. I know all the rest has something to do with it too, but those first two parts.....magic!

[Funk 50]

Yeah, I think when the guys say "it's the songs" they're attempting to be modest. Timothy's not going to say, "It's because we're all extremely accomplished musicians and vocalists who adhere to an old timey work ethic of much rehearsing and clean living, and we've managed to stay in good health all these years, and we are still up for the grind of world tours, etc..etc..." Neither is Glenn, Don or Joe going to say that. Of course it's the songs, but many other acts would not still be playing them to the level that our guys do, and the songs have survived the decades and still sound good.

I'll second all that MaryCalifornia :thumbsup:

I've yet to hear an Eagles cover that betters their original.

Apart from Love Will Keep Us Alive. I like all the live versions I've heard (Eagles (with Smith), Timothy solo, Winwood & Walsh at the Capaldi Tribute concert, Carrack maybe) more than the original HFO recording but that is the Eagles covering a previously unreleased song.

[VAisForEagleLovers]

This is a horribly long post, but UTW asked above what Eagles songs have been covered by other artists. A good many of these are from groups we've never heard of. The site I got this from wasn't complete, for instance, they didn't list Nancy Sinatra's horrid cover of Hotel California. If others know of any, let me know. I only looked up songs that are on Very Best Of... and I didn't didn't list the ones that are already cover songs (like LWKUA and Ol' 55). I also didn't include those on Common Thread.

Take It Easy: Nashville Superpickers, Wild Junkers, World Classic Rockers, Soren Sko, Peter Calo, Nashville, The Ugle Dog Skiffle Combo, The Acoustic Guitar Troubadours, Roch Voisine, Alice Ripley, Robby Longo.

Witchy Woman: None

Peaceful Easy Feeling: BW Stevenson, Roy Drusky, Cecilio & Kapono, Nashville Superpickers, Mirage Band, Jim “Kimo” West, The Acoustic Guitar Troubadours, Haroula Rose.

Tequila Sunrise: Nashville Superpickers, Peter Calo, Nashville, Jim “Kimo” West, Molly Hatchet, The Acoustic Guitar Troubadours.

Desperado: Linda Ronstadt, Susan Raye, Carpenters, The Jess Roden Band, Dianne Brooks, Randy Crawford, Lynn Anderson, Johnny Rodriguez, Kenny Rogers, Judy Collins, Chris LeDoux, The Harvard Din & Tonics, Nancy Harrow, Ringo Starr & His All-Star Band, Nashville Superpickers, The John Tesh Project, Morning Wood, Clifton Jansky, The Langley Schools Music Project, AC*Rock, Susan Wong, Ray Wilson, Peter Calo, Matthew Cook, Johnny Cash, Jill Johnson, Phil Driscoll, Michael Ball, Westlife, Journey South, Malene Mortensen, Me First and The Gimme Gimmes Massimo Priviero, Nashville Acoustic Trio, Logan Wells, Molly Hatchet, Yampa Valley Boys, Alana, The Acoustic Guitar Troubadours, Leo Gosselin, locofrank, Neil Diamond, Saskia & Serge, Lynda Carter, George Baker, Paul Potts, Diana Krall.

Doolin’ Dalton: The Acoustic Guitar Troubadours

Already Gone: Wilson Phillips, Jim “Kimo” West, The Acoustic Guitar Troubadours.

The Best of My Love: The 5th Dimension, Yvonne Elliman, Dobie Gray, Tanya Tucker, Aswad, Lori Johnson, Peter Calo, Rod Stewart, Jim “Kimo” West, The Acoustic Guitar Troubadours.

James Dean: The Acoustic Guitar Troubadours.

On The Border: None.

Lyin’ Eyes: Lynn Anderson, Nat Stuckey, Kenny Rankin, Allison Durbin, Nashville Superpickers, Vance Gilbert, Moe Bandy, James Last, Peter Calo, Michael Ball, The Acoustic Guitar Troubadours.

One of These Nights: CCCP, Morning Wood, Peter Calo, Julius Papp, Jim “Kimo” West, The Acoustic Guitar Troubadours, Kam Falk.
Take It To The Limit: Dave Mason, Etta James, Waylon Jennings & Willie Nelson, Casselberry-DuPree, Nashville Superpickers, World Classic Rockers, Chad Brock, Peter Calo, Phil Driscoll, Jim “Kimo” West, The Acoustic Guitar Troubadours, Kristine W.

After The Thrill Is Gone: Tanya Tucker.

Hotel California: Ted Weber, Sam Hui, Raymond Lefevre, Top of the Pops, Rene & Angela, John Press, Al B. Sure!, James Last and Orchestra, Wilson Phillips, Nashville Superpickers, Ho’aikane, Roberto Perera, The Moog Cookbook, West Coast All Stars, World Classic Rockers, Alabama 3, Kaare Norge, Julie B. Bonnie, Edi Fitzroy, Hank Marvin, Lisa Addeo, Emmerson Nogueira, Peter Calo, Helmut Lotti, William Hung, The Cat Empire, Too Close to See, Scott D. Davis, Nashville, The Dam Jam Fighters, Lori Ecker, Jim “Kimo” West, Stephanie Jackson, Yao Si Ting, Brady Goss, Leo Giannetto’s Jazz Project, The Acoustic Guitar Troubadours, Exilio, Rhythms del Mundo, Pink Turtle, Tangerine Dream, Rock 4, Soren Bodker Madsen, Born Crain, Daniel Ho, Noblesse Oblige, Nancy Sinatra.

Life In The Fast Lane: Ringo Starr & His All-Starr Band, Jill Johnson, The Acoustic Guitar Troubadours, Ingrid Kjosavik, Garth Brooks.

Wasted Time: Merry Clayton, Gov’t Mule.

Victim of Love: None

The Last Resort: The Acoustic Guitar Troubadours.

New Kid In Town: The Wynners, Top of the Pops, Nashville Superpickers, Peter Calo, Jim “Kimo” West, The Acoustic Guitar Troubadours, Nashville Acoustic Trio, Middlearth.

Heartache Tonight: Conway Twitty, John Anderson, Nashville Superpickers, Northern Lights & Vassar Clements, Jim “Kimo” West, The Acoustic Guitar Troubadours, Michael Buble.

The Sad Cafe: Peter Calo, Freedy Johnston.

I Can’t Tell You Why: Kenny G., Howard Hewett, Ringo Starr & His All-Starr Band, Nashville Superpickers, Brownstone, Tracy Wong, Larry Carlton, Peter Calo, Lazio Bane, The Acoustic Guitar Troubadours, Nona Reeves, Chromeo, Diana Krall.

The Long Run: Jim “Kimo” West, The Acoustic Guitar Troubadours, Reel Big Fish.

In The City: None.

Those Shoes: Beelzebubs, Antler.

Get Over It: None.

Love Will Keep Us Alive: Dave Mason.

Hole In The World: None.

[MaryCalifornia]

Cool, VA, thanks!

One of the best-known covers of ICTYW is by Chromeo, and they perform it live.

I'm not convinced that LWKUA is a cover. Someone else wrote it, just like PEF. As Funk 50 says, it was previously unreleased. Not like Ol' 55, I liken it to PEF.

I know we're not talking about solo songs here, but I just love the Ataris' version of Boys of Summer, I hear it all the time on the radio.

Wow, look at all of those covers of OOTN - I can't imagine I would enjoy anyone else's version of that song, but, you never know!

[VAisForEagleLovers]

Cool, VA, thanks!

One of the best-known covers of ICTYW is by Chromeo, and they perform it live.

I'm not convinced that LWKUA is a cover. Someone else wrote it, just like PEF. As Funk 50 says, it was previously unreleased. Not like Ol' 55, I liken it to PEF.

I know we're not talking about solo songs here, but I just love the Ataris' version of Boys of Summer, I hear it all the time on the radio.

Wow, look at all of those covers of OOTN - I can't imagine I would enjoy anyone else's version of that song, but, you never know!

I will add the ICTYW to my list! As for LWKUA, Paul Carrack released it in 1996, and since he was one of the songwriters, I don't consider it a 'cover' (notice I didn't add Jackson Browne on Take It Easy). Dave Mason also covered it, so I will add it, too (Dave's cover of it wasn't on that site, either!)

[Funk 50]

From memory;

Cher has performed Take It To The Limit and Those Shoes.
Tom Jones has murdered Take It To The Limit.
The Killers and The Gypsy Kings of course have performed Hotel California.
Stereophonics have a faithful version of The Last Resort on the b-side of one of thier singles.
Similarly Richard Marx released a live cover of Take It To the Limit, with an awful 80s guitar solo but the added bonus of Meisner and Schmit both helping out on vocals.
I'm pretty sure Richard also did a live performance of Dirty Laundry with celebrity news readers doing the vocals.
Journey Of The Sorcerer was adopted as the theme tune for the Hitchhiker's Guide To The Galaxy, Radio, TV and film adaptations. I think it was rerecorded at some point or two.

Solo wise there are a striking number of low grade South Pacific covers of Glenn's (plus the Eagles twice) Lover's Moon on YouTube.

Joe's main tunes are;
Rocky Mountain Way (Ozzy Osborne and Michael Bolton (Bolotin) are unforgettable),
Funk #49 (Van Halen & The Black Keys, Puddle Of Mudd)
Collage (Hedge & Donna, Golden Earring, Howling Rain, Adam Green And Binky Shapiro & The Three Degrees :jawdrop:)

I reckon Hedge & Donna's Collage is the first Walsh song I ever heard, many years before I heard The James Gang original. Even before I discovered Walsh. It's so obscure I haven't a clue how I heard it or how I remembered it.
I think Joe's only performed Collage a couple of times during James Gang reunion shows.
There's a few others. There may be enough for a Joe Walsh tribute album.

Timothy's, Tell Me What You Dream was an sizable 80s hit for Restless Heart. Judie Tzuke covered Tim's (Poco) I Can See Everything.

Henley's been covered by Ataris, DJ Sammy & Show Of Hands (Boys Of Summer), India Arie (Heart Of The Matter) and Lisa Marie Presley (Dirty Laundry). I'm sure there are others.

I'm not aware of any covers of the other three, but Felder's been known to do a few Eagles covers in his live set list.

[Freypower]

This is the original topic on Eagles covers:

https://eaglesonlinecentral.com/forum/showthread.php?t=213

However most of the discussion in the thread is about Keith Urban who once covered TITTL.

Neil Diamond covered Desperado not that long ago on his Dreams album but I wasn't interested in hearing it, although I love Neil Diamond.

[Funk 50]

From that topic it looks like Tom Jones murdered a second Eagles song besides Take It To The Limit.

Sticking to tunes that suit your voice is another ingredient of the Eagles outstanding success.

[VAisForEagleLovers]

Some of the songs have had a lot of people cover them, even if they're people we never heard of. I should look and see what popular songs from other artists were covered a lot and compare. This topic is, after all, about the quality of songs, presumably compared to others who haven't lasted 40+ years.

I agree, F50, they stuck with songs they could do and do well with the talent and voices they had available. It's what I meant by them sticking to what they do best and making sure those they got in later could not only fit in as well, but take them further.

[Ive always been a dreamer]

Back to UTW's original question, when I think of song power, I think of every aspect of a song ... the lyrics, the music, the vocals, the harmonies, the melody, the arrangement, and, yes, even the live performances. For me, it's the combination of all these components that make a song what it is. In the case of the Eagles, most of the time these components blended together beautifully to produce awesome songs.

[UndertheWire]

There's also the nostalgia.

I began to understand the connectivity between music and memory and nostalgia, and about how the amygdala (the brain’s memory center) can process chords and beats and rhythms and measures and create pleasure with recollections so thick you nearly choke on them.
http://www.sanfordherald.com/opinion/x43877699/Calling-all-greasers-now-I-understand

Although that doesn't explain why I don't feel the same about some of their contempories.