Thing you do NOT like about the Eagles?

[MortSahlFan]

Could be anything - something about the band, or an individual.. If I had to pick one, it would be how certain members to the mass audience are perceived, such as Don Felder, Bernie Leadon, and Randy Meisner.

I also think Joe Walsh got more fans because of things outside of music. I can't stand his voice (not bad on "Pretty Maids..."), and never cared for his guitar playing with the Eagles (or solo, or James Gang)..

Maybe I'll think of more later - looking forward to reading stuff from knowledgeable fans :)

[thelastresort]

I'm not too enamoured to Felder as a result of what has happened in the years since his dismissal. Of the band more generally, the fact they never released more live performances is an astronomical shortcoming IMO, and some of the percussion on LROOE sounds awful (e.g. Hole in the World).

I cannot believe you dislike JW's input! Even those who abhor the Eagles (and naturally Glenn and Don H.) love Joe! I do think he pandered to the whole Clown Prince label a touch but he never stopped being a superb musician: the fact that he co-wrote and sang the most delicate and heartfelt song on HC when his introduction was heralded as the turning it up to 11 says a lot: despite how much of the lifestyle he epitomised, he was still incredibly proficient at his day job. Some of his work with the James Gang and Barnstorm is absolutely wonderful, and his bond with Felder was pivotal in how well the Eagles did for the second half of the Seventies.

[travlnman2]

That Glenn is gone and they are no longer together :( :-|

[LovinGlennGirl]

Mostly the whole Felder thing, possibly could have been resolved in '80, took a break and came back then. But at least we had them a long time since.

I HATE that they are over forever, and that Glenn is gone. This double loss will make me sad forever. :(:weep:

[UndertheWire]

That they didn't stay young forever.

The Disco Strangler.

That the song Hotel California gets too much credit for their success. The breakthrough was Best of My Love, two years earlier. That reached #1, spent just as long in the charts, is on the GH1 album and was followed by #1 singles and albums.

[NightMistBlue]

That they don't release any archival material! What a tragedy. Yes, I said tragedy! It's way beyond "major bummer."

If only they were more like Fleetwood Mac, who have been so cool about releasing demo recordings, songs that didn't make the albums, alternate takes, etc.

[Freypower]

I have a few things I disliked about the band but I will try & keep it brief.

First & foremost is the relatively small size of their recorded output. No archival material as NMB said & worst, only one album after their reformation. The over-reliance on touring after the reunion basically meant that they barely attempted to pretend they were recording artists or songwriters as a group.

There was a reason why they coudn't get into the studio before 2001; Felder's complaints. This should have been dealt with much sooner. Who knows what would have happened? There was this gap between 1995 & 2001 when although they were back together, they did nothing because of Felder's demands. I find that sad & frustrating.

Only two live DVDs. There is even less excuse for this than there is for not releasing more albums. That they didn't put out a DVD for the LROOE tour is a huge mark against them. And quite frankly, HOTE is not a satisfactory alternative, in my view. After Glenn died I half expected that they would announce some sort of release; they didn't. Which leads me to...

Their failure to move with the times & embrace the web, social media & the reality that people wanted personal souvenirs of their shows. Their website & Facebook pages were used for announcing shows & linking to their merchandise site.

I do tend to agree with MSF that towards the end the shows had become vehicles for Joe. The Australian shows in 2015 were that way. I think they allowed his personality to become too dominant live.

Going back to the 70s of course, my main objection is the ever decreasing number of Glenn's lead vocals. Tragedy? Yes, in my view. It was one reason why he didn't get the recognition he deserved.

My own opinons on their music have changed, and I don't hold them in the same regard as I did, but that is my problem, not the band's.

[Topkat]

"There was a reason why they coudn't get into the studio before 2001; Felder's complaints. This should have been dealt with much sooner. Who knows what would have happened? There was this gap between 1995 & 2001 when although they were back together, they did nothing because of Felder's demands. I find that sad & frustrating."


I'm not so sure that is the reason they didn't record during this time. I mean they did a lot of touring during the 90's & then just kept going, I mean they did a full world tour & they take a month or 2 break in between legs. They were making a mint on the HFO tour so it lasted a really long time

I think they were just relying on their old hits & the single solo stuff & didn't really even have the time to do a new album... Also Henley is such a perfectionist & was probably very picky about what would be on a new album.

[Freypower]

I'm not so sure that is the reason they didn't record during this time. I mean they did a lot of touring during the 90's & then just kept going, I mean they did a full world tour & they take a month or 2 break in between legs. They were making a mint on the HFO tour so it lasted a really long time

I think they were just relying on their old hits & the single solo stuff & didn't really even have the time to do a new album... Also Henley is such a perfectionist & was probably very picky about what would be on a new album.

I used the years from 1996* - 2001 for a reason. They did not tour during those years.

* They were in Australia at the end of 1995 when I saw them. They may have done a few shows in 1996. Then they did not tour again until 2001 when Felder was fired. The only shows they played prior to his firing as far as I know were the Millennium shows at the end of 1999. Someone correct me if I am wrong.

Regardless, it is an indictment of them that they only managed to release one album in all those years, including the post-Felder years.

[Topkat]

Well.... perhaps they were taking a well deserved break from touring. No band can continuously tour. It must be grueling to just keep going .They were just coming off a very looong tour.

Also maybe they wanted to add some new material. They must have started working on LROOE at the writing stages at least.

Also, If they were going to fire Don Felder, they needed to replace him, so I would imagine they were considering who that might be??? I never heard of Stuart Smith, so I would imagine they were considering any number of guitar players for the job. It's all speculation and at this point, what does it really matter????

[thelastresort]

Their failure to move with the times & embrace the web, social media & the reality that people wanted personal souvenirs of their shows. Their website & Facebook pages were used for announcing shows & linking to their merchandise site.


This is a very good one which I forgot. If you look at the likes of Pink Floyd, Dire Straits, Lynyrd Skynyrd and Black Sabbath who are all bands of a similar era and similar popularity to the Eagles whom I also happen to 'Like' on Facebook then the contrast between them and the Eagles's presence is gargantuan. Joe does a little bit by himself and Felder isn't too bad (on Twitter at least), but any official Eagles (social) media is as good as dormant, even when they were still active. I know Don H. despises it and I suspect that's why it is the way it is, but when you see Pink Floyd on there as good as every day posting YouTube links to their songs, interviews and 'On this day...' content you really have to think the Eagles missed a huge one here. Yes, their name is still out there because of how good they were, but think of the bridges they could have crossed if they didn't remove Hotel California videos every 30 minutes, or actually gave their fans something to mull over on Facebook. Lynyrd Skynyrd even post fan covers on their official page!

[Freypower]

Well.... perhaps they were taking a well deserved break from touring. No band can continuously tour. It must be grueling to just keep going .They were just coming off a very looong tour.

Also maybe they wanted to add some new material. They must have started working on LROOE at the writing stages at least.

Also, If they were going to fire Don Felder, they needed to replace him, so I would imagine they were considering who that might be??? I never heard of Stuart Smith, so I would imagine they were considering any number of guitar players for the job. It's all speculation and at this point, what does it really matter????

The topic was started, so I responded to it. Touché, I guess, after I said in the Kennedy Centre thread 'what difference does it make'.

The 'they wanted to add some new material' bit is all very well. The point is the inordinate amount of time they spent before they actually DID produce new material.

They didn't fire Felder until February 2001. Are you seriously suggesting they spent the previous FOUR YEARS wondering who they would replace him with?

[Henley Honey]

The only issue I ever had was that they announced their tour dates in drips and drabs. You'd never know if it would be more fortuitous for you to book a show further from your home if it was announced first or if you should hope for another date closer to home. Other than that -- nope. The inner workings of the band were just that. Not for me to chime in on or debate.

[buffyfan145]

I agree on about how there hasn't been more collectors albums/merchandise, DVDs, or other recordings released. I do think that will change as the years go on like how it has for most classic bands and artists. It's usually profitable. I also agree about the Felder situation but it more just always made me sad, and sometimes still does seeing the fans divided.

And this one really isn't about the Eagles but the way some non-Eagles fans absolutely hate them and make fun of us that are fans.

[Topkat]

The topic was started, so I responded to it. Touché, I guess, after I said in the Kennedy Centre thread 'what difference does it make'.

The 'they wanted to add some new material' bit is all very well. The point is the inordinate amount of time they spent before they actually DID produce new material.

They didn't fire Felder until February 2001. Are you seriously suggesting they spent the previous FOUR YEARS wondering who they would replace him with?

Well, they DO or shall I say DID take a VERY long time to produce new material. It was probably difficult to come close to the amazing songs that they already had done... Once a band has huge success & big hits, the pressure to produce something as good is on, so I imagine it was difficult to beat what they already had.

I am not suggesting in any way that they were pondering 4 years about who will replace Felder. Since they fired him in 2001, there must have been plenty of disagreements during that time.

But the fact is they didn't need the money, so whatever they were doing for 4 years, I think much of it was break time & family time. They were probably sick of touring.

[Delilah]

There was a reason why they coudn't get into the studio before 2001; Felder's complaints. This should have been dealt with much sooner. Who knows what would have happened? There was this gap between 1995 & 2001 when although they were back together, they did nothing because of Felder's demands.I find that sad & frustrating.


I find this statement unfair. Who really knows everything going on with the band at the time? There could have personal, family or health issues. Don H must have been working on his solo album during this time; Joe was touring, I believe and working with Ringo. I'm not saying that Don F's concerns about accounting and books didn't factor into the situation but to make him the sole scapegoat is a stretch. After he was fired, the band took years to complete their next album, working with a multitude of musicians and from various locations apart from each other; their producer Bill Symczyk remarked how the same old problems and tensions were re-appearing. All this without Felder around.

[Vector]

Could be anything - something about the band, or an individual.. If I had to pick one, it would be how certain members to the mass audience are perceived, such as Don Felder, Bernie Leadon, and Randy Meisner.

I also think Joe Walsh got more fans because of things outside of music. I can't stand his voice (not bad on "Pretty Maids..."), and never cared for his guitar playing with the Eagles (or solo, or James Gang)..

Maybe I'll think of more later - looking forward to reading stuff from knowledgeable fans :)

My issues with them is best summed up in this thread.

https://www.eaglesonlinecentral.com/forum/showthread.php?t=4257

I will add here that I can see where some might not care for Walsh's singing, but I cannot recall anyone who has disliked his guitar playing. :woah:

[Funk 50]

First & foremost is the relatively small size of their recorded output. No archival material as NMB said & worst, only one album after their reformation. The over-reliance on touring after the reunion basically meant that they barely attempted to pretend they were recording artists or songwriters as a group.

There was a reason why they coudn't get into the studio before 2001; Felder's complaints. This should have been dealt with much sooner. Who knows what would have happened? There was this gap between 1995 & 2001 when although they were back together, they did nothing because of Felder's demands. I find that sad & frustrating.

Only two live DVDs. There is even less excuse for this than there is for not releasing more albums. That they didn't put out a DVD for the LROOE tour is a huge mark against them. And quite frankly, HOTE is not a satisfactory alternative, in my view. After Glenn died I half expected that they would announce some sort of release; they didn't. Which leads me to...

Their failure to move with the times & embrace the web, social media & the reality that people wanted personal souvenirs of their shows. Their website & Facebook pages were used for announcing shows & linking to their merchandise site.

I do tend to agree with MSF that towards the end the shows had become vehicles for Joe. The Australian shows in 2015 were that way. I think they allowed his personality to become too dominant live.

Going back to the 70s of course, my main objection is the ever decreasing number of Glenn's lead vocals. Tragedy? Yes, in my view. It was one reason why he didn't get the recognition he deserved.


What she said :nod:

[UndertheWire]

I think it's unfair to blame the lack of output between 1996 and 2001 on Don Felder. He may have contributed stress but I believe it was primarily Glenn's choice (as always) and he had his own, good reasons. . If you look back at interviews from the 1990s, it appears that the original plan was to reunite for one tour. That tour ended in August 1996 and according to Don Felder, it was Glenn's decision (and I believe Felder).

We don't know Glenn's reasons but I'll note that Taylor would have been about to start school, making it harder to take the family on tour and that Glenn probably became aware of his RA in the 90s (Irving said 15 years but one of Glenn's friends talked of a longer period). Knowing he had a chronic, potentially crippling disease might have given him different priorities.

I agree that it's disappointing that they produced so little new music after 1994 but I can't blame for choosing to live their lives the way they wanted. I do wish they'd check out those archives and maybe relax the quality control just a little. I can't believe there isn't more (those Glyn Johns On the Border recordings?). I'd also like full, clean versions of the performances they used in the documentary.

[Freypower]

I think it's unfair to blame the lack of output between 1996 and 2001 on Don Felder. He may have contributed stress but I believe it was primarily Glenn's choice (as always) and he had his own, good reasons. . If you look back at interviews from the 1990s, it appears that the original plan was to reunite for one tour. That tour ended in August 1996 and according to Don Felder, it was Glenn's decision (and I believe Felder).

We don't know Glenn's reasons but I'll note that Taylor would have been about to start school, making it harder to take the family on tour and that Glenn probably became aware of his RA in the 90s (Irving said 15 years but one of Glenn's friends talked of a longer period). Knowing he had a chronic, potentially crippling disease might have given him different priorities.

I agree that it's disappointing that they produced so little new music after 1994 but I can't blame for choosing to live their lives the way they wanted. I do wish they'd check out those archives and maybe relax the quality control just a little. I can't believe there isn't more (those Glyn Johns On the Border recordings?). I'd also like full, clean versions of the performances they used in the documentary.

OK, fair enough, but the thread is about what we disliked, and I had assumed that the problems with Felder built up over those few years, until they reached a breaking point.

I do concede Delilah's point about the same old problems resurfacing when they did finally try to make an album. This is another element of what was frustrating about them - their inability to sacrifice their various egos & just get on with it. That goes back to what I said about the over reliance on touring.

It's nice to see F50 agree with me unreservedly! :shock:

[Brooke]

I know they have always said there was nothing saved in the vaults, but I bet there was. Concerts were nearly always recorded. Sure wish they would release some more of it.

And their inability to just get along and make new music. Back in the early 2000s LROOE was waited on forever. I know it was due to the lawsuits, but still.....and that we don't really know much about who did what on that album besides the vocals.

Agree too about social media. They are missing the boat!

[thelastresort]

Lord, please let this be true! Old concert footage would be great. I swear that I would push my momma down the stairs while she was wearing roller skates just to get a peek into that vault.

Maybe their kids will release it one day. I hope I'm still alive when they do. :razz:

Well they sat on the Capital Center material that came with HOTE for the best part of 40 years without the slightest inkling of its existence, and certain bits and pieces in the same documentary I've never seen before or since (the Long Run tour clips for example). I suspect it fell foul of the Henley perfectionism criteria in many cases (for example only releasing less than half of the Capital Center gig), but I cannot believe for a second there was no financial incentive to record the LROOE or HOTE tours for live release. Such a glaring omission from their legacy!

[WalshFan88]

Well I LOVE this band but I can name a few things, not all of them their fault.

First of all, I don't "hate" anything about the band. I do have issues with things.

Now OP decided to say something about Joe Walsh's guitar playing, so I'm going to start mine off in a similar light. Not to "get back at them" but it's something I felt anyway and fair is fair. This isn't being created to say something in retaliation but things I've thought for years. I just feel this is the thread to say it.

I've never been a fan of Bernie Leadon. Again, I think he was an important person in the band's history and is an accomplished player but for me it's like nails on a chalkboard. I'm a rock guy, and a improv bluesy non-technical guitar player. I don't like technicality, as it's very un-rock and roll to me so I'll always take a "sloppy" Jimmy Page over a Steve Vai shredfest any damn day. Now Bernie isn't like that, but the whole country style and the fact that he tried to hold back the rockier side of the Eagles is a sore spot for me. I've always said getting Joe Walsh is the best thing they ever did and that IMO the output with Felder, and even moreso Felder and Walsh was so much better for me than the first two Eagles albums. They are a AOR classic rock band to me and I just appreciate the later Eagles more. It's just my thing. I think Joe Walsh is a great fit for the band and to me they were always better as a rock n' roll supergroup.

Secondly, I am not a fan of the drama this band carries with it, not always at fault of their own. Be it Eagles haters, the polarizing Felder issue, etc. All bands have controversy and drama but it is my opinion after a lot of research and experience that the Eagles top just about every other band in this area. Again, not all at their feet. It's mostly the workings of other people. It just seems like someone has something to say negatively about the band, one or more members, and certainly about the Don Felder situation. It would have been nice to enjoy the band without all of that conflict and having to censor yourself when it comes to sides, favorites, on and on. But baggage is baggage, and I'll still take them even with baggage. But it is a bit tiring and especially online. Gets a lil' old.

Lastly, I never cared for the hierarchy of the band. Obviously Frey/Henley overtook the band's control and especially Glenn. To me I kinda wish they all had kept the Eagles Ltd thing and when Joe and Tim came on, had them join it rather than being glorified sideman, despite calling them Eagles. I wish the other guys had more say in songs, band decisions, and weren't at times treated like they were sidemen to the Frey/Henley show. I'm an idealist, fully admitted, but I think it should be a "band band" (to quote Azoff on HOTE) and be a bunch of brothers rather than it being the way it was. I feel fairness is important and I think the hierarchy probably drove them apart at times, although some here have said and believe it kept them together. I just wish everyone had gotten a fair shake at what the band did and song input. Obviously this itself is a very polarizing take, but it is ultimately my belief. Nothing towards anyone here tho. It reminds me of the Black Crowes. It got to be so big of a business with conflicts, that brothers in BLOOD no longer speak, Chris and Rich Robinson no longer speak and probably don't have family get togethers. That's wrong IMO.

[VillageGirl]

I agree with everything Walshfan said, except I really like Bernie and their early sound.

Other thing that I have mixed feelings about is HOTE. At first I thought it was fascinating. I love documentaries. But after watching it a few times and hearing what some not so die hard Eagles fans had to say about it, it kind of left me with an uneasy feeling. Even Bill Hader, the comedian, said it was just like watching bullies.

I wish I had never seen it as it does kind of remind me of Mean Girls, and I wonder how many people would be okay with some of the things said by members if they weren't devoted Eagles fans.

[NightMistBlue]

I know they have always said there was nothing saved in the vaults, but I bet there was. Concerts were nearly always recorded.

Also, studio engineers are notorious for having private collections - tapes that they've brought home of everyone they've worked with.

Plus there's negligence. Didn't someone on these forums tell us about all the old master tapes that were thrown out in the street (literally) when Olympic Studios in London closed down?

[Vector]

I agree with everything Walshfan said, except I really like Bernie and their early sound.

Other thing that I have mixed feelings about is HOTE. At first I thought it was fascinating. I love documentaries. But after watching it a few times and hearing what some not so die hard Eagles fans had to say about it, it kind of left me with an uneasy feeling. Even Bill Hader, the comedian, said it was just like watching bullies.

I wish I had never seen it as it does kind of remind me of Mean Girls, and I wonder how many people would be okay with some of the things said by members if they weren't devoted Eagles fans.



That is one of the main themes of the thread I started on this very subject. Prior to the HOE, I didn't know much about the bands history, and certainly little to nothing about the individual personalities/conflicts. But the documentary caused me to go on a journey to find out how accurate it was. Thus far, I have not liked much of what I have found out, especially about Frey & Henley.

I keep hoping something will soften my view, and had hoped the Kennedy Honors would be just such an opportunity.
Yet, it is not to be I guess.

[Funk 50]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brooke View Post
I know they have always said there was nothing saved in the vaults, but I bet there was. Concerts were nearly always recorded.

Also, studio engineers are notorious for having private collections - tapes that they've brought home of everyone they've worked with.

Plus there's negligence. Didn't someone on these forums tell us about all the old master tapes that were thrown out in the street (literally) when Olympic Studios in London closed down?

When it comes to making stuff freely available to their fans, Genesis are the complete opposite of Eagles. Every tour they did was broadcast live on the radio or even on TV. Phil Collins would routinely leave every band concert or session with a soundboard copy of the performance for his own critical perusal and he ended up with an extensive archive of material.

In the early days of CD Bootlegs, Phil said he was concerned that fans were paying extortionate fees for lousy sounding bootleg recordings. I guess the fact that, soundboard recordings of practically every Genesis (and Collins solo) show, are now, easily available on the internet, even advertised on the Genesis fan site, suggests that Phil has quietly made his archive freely available to the fans.

When Genesis dug deep to find rarities to put on their first box set they were surprised at the amount of stuff that they heard about, after they'd released it. Many people had Genesis obscurities stored away without realising how rare they were, until the rarities box set came out.

As far as I know, The Eagles don't have an archivist. Henley is strongly against this type of material being made public at all . He's not even keen on Live Recordings so I can understand any one, with illicit Eagles recordings, fearing litigation and excommunication, staying very quiet about it.

I thought the Bill Halverson recordings would be the start of obscure Eagles material surfacing (How great would they have been on Eagles Selected Works) but it hasn't happened. I can't believe that Halverson was the only guy who ignored the Eagles request to destroy everything.

I'm still confident that I'll hear something, previously unreleased from the Eagles in future, even if it was actually recorded decades ago, it's just a case of being extraordinarily patient. :)

[Scarlet Sun]

When it comes to making stuff freely available to their fans, Genesis are the complete opposite of Eagles. Every tour they did was broadcast live on the radio or even on TV. Phil Collins would routinely leave every band concert or session with a soundboard copy of the performance for his own critical perusal and he ended up with an extensive archive of material.

In the early days of CD Bootlegs, Phil said he was concerned that fans were paying extortionate fees for lousy sounding bootleg recordings. I guess the fact that, soundboard recordings of practically every Genesis (and Collins solo) show, are now, easily available on the internet, even advertised on the Genesis fan site, suggests that Phil has quietly made his archive freely available to the fans.

When Genesis dug deep to find rarities to put on their first box set they were surprised at the amount of stuff that they heard about, after they'd released it. Many people had Genesis obscurities stored away without realising how rare they were, until the rarities box set came out.

As far as I know, The Eagles don't have an archivist. Henley is strongly against this type of material being made public at all . He's not even keen on Live Recordings so I can understand any one, with illicit Eagles recordings, fearing litigation and excommunication, staying very quiet about it.

I thought the Bill Halverson recordings would be the start of obscure Eagles material surfacing (How great would they have been on Eagles Selected Works) but it hasn't happened. I can't believe that Halverson was the only guy who ignored the Eagles request to destroy everything.

I'm still confident that I'll hear something, previously unreleased from the Eagles in future, even if it was actually recorded decades ago, it's just a case of being extraordinarily patient. :)
Indeed

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[NightMistBlue]

We need patience *and* longevity. I hope I'm still around on the earth plane when the Eagles vault(s) are pried open at last.

OT: actually, this can go on my motivational list, "Reasons to Quit Smoking"

[TW]

that don henley doesnt have twitter